The BRA board had been scheduled to vote on a proposed 17-unit condos building at Weld and Centre streets tomorrow, but has postponed the vote to let the developer answer neighborhood concerns about its overall size and height.
Developer John Sullivan first proposed replacing the long closed Weld-American gas station with condos this past spring.
Residents applauded the general idea but said that at four stories, the building was too tall - in particular for residents living down a slope behind the building.
In a message to the Longfellow Area Neighborhood Association this week, BRA project manager Chris Tracy wrote:
Based on the dialogue at our public meeting on August 27 and the public comments received by the BRA we have asked the proponent to consider this feedback and respond accordingly. In particular, the BRA has heard from the community that the size and massing of the proposal is too large, therefore, we’ve asked the proponent to reconsider the size and massing of the building.
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Comments
Siiiiiiiiiigh
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 2:02pm
"Housing is too expensive BUT DON'T BUILD MORE HOUSING OK!?!?!?"
Ya because
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:20pm
building $2,500 per month apartments is exactly what a working class neighborhood wants.
Let's try not to turn Rozie into another Southie, JP, C-Town yuppie neighborhood.
Oh, I see
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 8:21pm
You would prefer that all the multifamily housing that is affordable to families be bought up and renovated into luxury condos instead?
Because that is what will happen. Money can go into these, or it can take over your neighborhood.
Why dont you
By anon
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 8:56am
Worry about your N Shore suburb and well worry about our neighborhood.
Thanks,
nah..
By SoBo-Yuppie
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 10:10am
..we need the input of outsiders. there are still too many uneducated, cranky townies in boston. luckily that demographic is getting smaller by the month!
Your schtick...
By Michael Kerpan
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 10:23am
... is getting old. (correction "has long since gotten old").
Asset prices don't always rise.
By anon
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 4:17pm
The pot of gold windfalls repeatedly described are new. Many families who sold before, in the bleak urban flight period were lucky to get 70k for a multi family. That's about what my mother got in the early 70s for her Medford family home.
It was a 3 floor Victorian with lots of intricate trim on Manning Street, right near the river. It's probably at that windfall value level now.
Case and Shiller's research on home price trends is probably the most useful guide to boom and bust cycles. To assume there will always be windfalls is infantile. A decline trend bust cycle will happen. We haven't abolished those cycles.
So while you may gloat over big scores now, a significant downturn can make a hash of it fairly soon and a more nuanced and long frame view is a great way to get out of the rut of glib repetitions that eventually go south.
Magic
By RickW
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 9:37pm
You want a magic fairy to come down from outer space, wave a wand, and make brand new, energy efficient, modern apartments cost less than old, unrenovated POS apartments in 100 year old houses. Yes, they'll be more expensive than existing apartments. MORE IMPORTANTLY, yes, they'll help suppress rent inflation in existing units.
Hey, my house was built in
By anon
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 9:28am
Hey, my house was built in 1860. If your going to call it out as POS at least have the decency to get the age correct!
Condos?
By cw in boston
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 9:51pm
Aren't these condos and not rentals?
Condos not rentals
By not in the dark
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 10:51pm
Expected asking price $475,000+
I do believe Rozzie had a
By bgl
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 11:19pm
I do believe Rozzie had a higher median single family home price last year than Westie, so yeah, way late there. Triple Deckers on Belgrade are going for close to a mil, and condos in 2 families 400-500k.
If you own, update the kitchen and bathroom, sell...
By anon
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 12:22am
and get out of dodge. Buy a cheap farmhouse in upstate NY or ME, or some bungalow in Key West and live like a KING! Boston has turned into a yuppie sewer, and the wave of yuppie-dom won't stop until the entire city is the Disney World of the North East. Boston as you knew it as a child is ovah! It will never be the same. People say "Build more housing, that'll change it!" Bullshit. The richest assholes on Earth have been moving to a few select cities in the US, and Boston's one of them. The area can't possibly absorb that much influx of money and keep a legitimate affordable housing stock. None of these new folks give a shit about Boston's "charm". IT'S GONE! This isn't Boston anymore, it's some Harvard, BU, Tri-state scum bastardization! Bulldoze all the triple deckers, all the old factories, keep the Paul Revere house and new people will still come cause they don't give a shit. They want fancy colleges, and gleaming buildings. Make money, man, and move somewhere normal, where normal people can live. It sure as hell ain't here.
" Boston as you knew it as a
By Manny
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 8:33am
" Boston as you knew it as a child is ovah!"--- Good ! It was one of if not the most racist city in America. I have lived here my whole life and nothing makes me happier than when I go down to Castle Island or West Roxbury and see all kinds of people enjoying what this city has to offer. Are there things I will miss,yes,but in my mind the positive far outweighs the negative. If you hate it so much get out while the getting is good and don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
By Manny on Thu, 09/17/2015 -
By kvn
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 9:50am
By Manny on Thu, 09/17/2015 - 8:33am
" Boston as you knew it as a child is ovah!"--- Good ! It was one of if not the most racist city in America. I have lived here my whole life ''
Grew up in Somerville
By Manny on Tue, 09/15/2015 - 2:49pm
''I grew up in Somerville. Spent the first 35 years of my life there and never had a desire to leave. I lived there when it was called Slumerville for legit reasons in some parts ''
Best of both worlds ?
Not sure what you mean
By Manny
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 11:41am
So I have to be in the city limits and not less than a mile from the border to be from Boston ? Ok, you got me. Somerville was so different then, when we crossed the city line the sun would come out and birds would sing.
Well
By Waquiot
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 2:38pm
If those of us who actually live in Boston as long as you have Somerville started to pontificate about Somerville as if we lived there, talking it down and whatnot, would you be cool with that?
How was the poster "talking
By anon
Fri, 09/18/2015 - 9:29am
How was the poster "talking down" about Boston? It was one of the most racist cities in the country. It's still one of the most segregated. It IS great to see people of all types at Castle Island. It IS great to see people of color be able to walk and through and live in West Roxbury. We shouldn't water down the truth and just bc the poster grew up in Somerville doesn't mean they aren't right.
Yes, I was born and raised in Boston - just in case you were wondering.
Yes...
By Manny
Fri, 09/18/2015 - 9:36am
...if it was accurate and you knew what Somerville's issues were. Was Boston not one of the most racist cities in America ? Has that not changed for the better? We can talk about Somerville's issues back in the 70's and 80's and beyond if you like. I don't wear rose colored glasses and think that all was perfect.
I don't get this "if you lived there" business. Was I unable to see Boston's problems from a few streets away ? Was Channel 5's news cast different in Somerville? Did I not see people move into Somerville from Boston to avoid busing ? Did parents from Charlestown not send their kids to parochial schools in Somerville to also avoid busing ? Did the Globe have a special Somerville edition? So the Winter Hill Gang wasn't a Boston gang because Winter Hill isn't in Boston? Get over yourselves.
Yes, let's cherry pick the race issue....
By anon
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 6:28pm
not like the same shit wasn't going on in Chicago, NYC, and it was obviously much worse all over the South. The 60's and 70's weren't pretty ANYWHERE in urban America, so let's move beyond that.
I see what's been happening gradually over the past 2 decades (give or take) in Boston is an absolute exclusion of the middle class, working class, and the poor/destitute of the city. Same as in NYC, DC, SF, etc. In a rush to make Boston a "destination" or "world-class city" the city's entire identity of the past 150 years (or more) has been steamrolled. Ethnic enclaves don't really exist anymore, and it can't possibly be a destination for newer groups of immigrants. At least not the way it used to be. Where could they possibly afford to live?
Newcomers always say "Cities change, get over it!" Yeah, well, this particular change is FAR out of step with what has happened before. It's not the Irish, Italians, Puerto Ricans, Chinese, or Vietnamese moving here looking for a new start in life. It's the coddled class from all over the US and the world.
The most racist city in the country?
By anon
Fri, 09/18/2015 - 8:06am
Are you serious? And yet, tons of 'diverse' people still moved here, even though the 'townies' were so mean and racist? The only unusual thing about Boston compared to other large east coast cities is it maintained a majority white population while orhers had greater 'white flight', and because it didn't become majority minority (today, the city is around 50/50) it's racist? Just like Seattle is racist because it's 'so white'? I lived in L.A., which is majority Hispanic/Latino, and I'm white non-Hispanic; I never whined about the fact I was a minority, and understood natural migration patterns. I'm white, grew up here in neighborhoods with whites, blacks, Spanish speakers, Asians, etc. My racist mom would tell me and my brothers and sisters to treat everyone equally and as individuals, and would meet and welcome new neighbors, regardless of the skin tone or ethnicity. And your post received 14 up votes? Sad. And you wonder why so many 'townies' are cranky and unfriendly. For such a mean, racist, cold, unfriendly place, we sure have a lot of people who come here to live, go to school, and work here. This is a huge country, with plenty of other cities, the majority of them could use a shot in the arm, because they aren't in nearly as good, thriving condition as the Boston (area), and they're cheap, much cheaper, to live in. Yet tons of people still crowd into this expensive, cold, racist, unfriendly city. Wow. Just wow.
Your point? I still know
By anon
Fri, 09/18/2015 - 9:37am
Your point? I still know people of color that won't come to live here due to Boston's reputation. It's still incredibly segregated and yes we were a well known racist city. Does that mean everyone one was racist? No. Try to look at it from someone that doesn't have white skin.
I had friends who still had bottles thrown at their cars while driving through Southie in the late 90's. I knew people from Southie (and no this isn't a Southie bash - just examples) that would piss on gay ppl when they tried to go to the infamous St. Paddy's day parade. Literally piss.on.them. Do you remember busing? DO you remember the hate that was spewed?
Yes, we are changing and that is awesome but we have been slow to change. That is just the truth.
yes I am serious
By Manny
Fri, 09/18/2015 - 9:48am
you do not remember that whole busing thing ?
Busing
By anon
Fri, 09/18/2015 - 10:30am
was implemented in a scandalous fashion, and did incredible damage that is still obvious today. And if you remember it it, than you remember the extreme levels of street crime and violence of the 70s and 80s, most of it not committed by white 'townies'. The violent crime wave that hit urban America in themid to late 60s, into the 70s, 80s, up to today, was well established by the time busing was implemented in the City of Boston (just Boston, a geographically small big city, none of the surrounding metro area). Most people in city neighborhoods not still over-run by this violence looked at places like Roxbury, and the massive middle class abandonment and redlining in places pike Mattapan, with horror. There was a HUGE amount of (more often than not unreported) violence committed by black perps, against whites (much more common than the reverse), and each other. Busing needless to say made the situation far worse. I can't believe any sane, intelligent person would defend busing today. It was a COMPLETE failure, and the people who fought it were correct, even though they were demonized by our very smug, class conscious elite (left, right, doesn't matter).
Is there something I can do
By Sock_Puppet
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 9:14am
To help this process along? I want fancy colleges and gleaming buildings.
This is where we see how serious the administration is
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 7:58pm
If Walsh steps up to the plate and supports housing in the neighborhoods then he really is committed to solving the housing crisis. If not, well, there's always 2017.
Link to the PNF (for
By bgl
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 2:19pm
Link to the PNF (for renderings):
http://www.bostonredevelopmentauthority.org/projec...
So, I like that it was kind of postponed, but not for the reasoning. The building is drab (at best), but such is all projects like this across the city I feel, so w/e. What I would love to see, however, would be for them to actually work with the existing streetscape - they should continue the ground floor retail around the corner, and have 3 levels of condos on top. Put the parking/entrance after the corner and not directly on Centre, and keep all the parking behind. Might need to bury the garage with retail/commercial/offices on the first floor, but, it would just flow so much better with the rest of that street.
More retail
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:13pm
Is there a need for that there? There's already a lot of retail right there and there's plenty of empty spaces 'downtown' I'd rather have housing or parking for the housing.
I guess your right - but
By bgl
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 11:17pm
I guess your right - but AFIAK there is only one building with a vacancy and its upper level office space (from what I remember, haven't been down there for a few weeks). Just figure if they could tie it in with the rest of the commericial block and continue the street wall for the block it would flow way better - maybe just have one commercial space (for say a restaurant) that connects to the existing commercial with the rest of the run in door garage/non commercial facade.
No motor vehicle entrance on Weld Street!
By cat
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:33pm
The City had ruled out accessing the property from Weld Street.
For those of us in the neighborhood; we would love to be at a point where we can get the developer to make the proposal more aesthetically pleasing....Our first priority is to get the size of the building to fit more appropriately to the neighborhood. Our second priority is the get the City to implement a traffic plan that does not further hinder traffic to the area; promotes better pedestrian access while not increasing parking issues in the surrounding residential streets.
We realize that the existing lot is an eyesore and are pleased to have someone come in and develop the land. We are NOT however going to settle for just anything that gets put in front of us.
I personally am grateful that the City did not just rubber stamp the proposal just because it was 'as of right'. Apparently the City representatives were listening very well at the community meetings. There is no doubt that there was likely a substantial amount of constructive criticism during the comment phase as well.
I know the neighborhood well,
By bgl
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 11:23pm
I know the neighborhood well, I grew up near there and spent years going past there. Its pretty crappy compared to other commercial districts (Centre Street in West Roxbury around the rotary, or the Square), and the that has been a shit hole blighted plot for years. Isn't the ground contaminated, too? If they can build a building of that height by Roche's and Bellevue, they can build it there.
The lot is not condusive to an underground garage
By cat
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:54pm
Surveys found there is ledge that prevents putting anything too deep.
Burying the garage adds a
By anon
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 7:24am
Burying the garage adds a huge cost onto these kinds of buildings, kiss any pretense at affordability goodbye.
The Weylu's
By Kathode
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 3:45pm
of West Roxbury.
reasonable
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 4:32pm
Unlike the people who were mad about the Roberts St.building, this seems more reasonable. 2-3 stories might work better. Pretty much, most of us in Roslindale probably have a 3 story (including the roof) tall building next to where we live so that's par for the course.
You have those 4-story condos along Washington
By Michael Kerpan
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 5:01pm
.. with no elevators (and essentially all of the grounds devoted to parking). It still looks like there may be unsold units in this development.
Ya 10 years later
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 8:00pm
And nobody what's to pay $500k to live smack in the middle of 2 housing projects.
Shocker!
Too Short
By BlackKat
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:03pm
5 stories is hardly towering overhead. Nigh every building on Commonwealth Ave is 5 stories. There needs to be higher density in Roslindale and that means slightly taller. Such will drive transit improvements to the area and bring in more accessible shopping for those who can't drive to Roche or Stop and Shop. It's the way to motivate the neighborhood to be a viable, affordable area for people without cars.
Are you familiar with the site?
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:11pm
For example, the new buildings on Belgrade can and should be high because they are surrounded by commercial buildings and train tracks. The new building at the end of Cummins Hwy. is also tall given the site. In this case, I don't see a problem with accommodating neighbors in single family or smaller multi-family houses.
There are plenty more places to build tall, high density buildings without unduly impacting residents. For example, the bus lot by Forrest Hills, as planned.
If you knew the area
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:15pm
you would know the houses directly behind the proposed structure are about 15-20 ft below the grade of the land for the proposed structure.
So Ya, 3 stories is already like 5.
NO there does not need to be higher density in Roslindale
By cat
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 6:45pm
This is not downtown. Roslindale is a mere 3.5 mile portion of a great City. We do NOT need buildings that mirror areas that are already more dense. I moved here specifically because the area was mostly low rise or small multi family homes while still being part of the City.
More housing does not promote more reasonably priced accommodations. We only have to look at some of our other City neighborhoods to see what a misnomer that is.
The outlying neighborhoods of Boston should be able to retain the charm that drew so many to the area. Roslindale is a neighborhood that is conducive to walking to shopping. There are bus routes that take you right up either Washington Street or Centre and Spring Street. We could use some ramped up public transportation, but we are not T desolate either.
Do you live here?
Three or four stories
By Sally
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 7:52pm
is hardly a skyscraper. For a little neighborhood center, that seems wholly fitting and not out of character with the rest of the neighborhood. Density of this kind seems like the best way to preserve lively town centers (remember that when most of Roslindale was built, there was no Dedham mall, etc). That all said, it sounds good that the community is involved and the developer will be responsive to local opinions.
Your Dedham mall reference is odd
By anon
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 8:12pm
Are you new here and referring to the "new" Dedham mall or are you trying to reference the old mall being built?
Also Weld & Centre is FAR from a city "center" as is Rozie.
Character of the neighborhood? What character does an apt building add to a single family/multi family neighborhood?
Yes there are CONDO'S across the street where evergreen travel once way, but that's not the same as an Apt complex.
No, I'm not new here.
By Sally
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 10:58pm
My point is that Roslindale was built before malls, big supermarkets and shopping centers. If you wanted groceries, you walked down to your little local grocer. Ditto butcher, baker, hardware store, etc. With competition from the Targets and Home Depots and Macy's of the world and more people driving everywhere, we have to reimagine these small neighborhood centers. And again, I don't believe that a 3-4 story building is any kind of threat to the character of places like Roslindale Square.
This is nowhere near Rosi square, Sally.
By J not logged in
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 12:54am
Weld and Centre is over a mile's drive from Adams Park (the titular center of Rosi Square). It's directly across the street from the Arboretum's western meadow.
I was speaking generally
By Sally
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 7:56am
in response to the original comment and thinking broadly of the resistance we keep seeing to denser/taller neighborhood housing. As I said, community process is a good thing and it sounds as if the height issue here is legit but 3-4 stories is not going to turn anyplace into Downtown Xing or ruin the character of a neighborhood.
This is not a town center.
By not in the dark
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 10:49pm
This is not a town center.
Lol. I grew up in (and around
By bgl
Wed, 09/16/2015 - 11:10pm
Lol. I grew up in (and around) Rozzie. WTF are you talking about? It used to be the hood and in the past 10-15 years, yuppies (*cough*) moved in thinking it was an extension of JP/West Roxbury. I assume you are also part of the movement to keep chains out of the Square? News flash, there is already a 7/11, D&D, Dominos, Staples (used to be Ashmont Lumber), etc. Go away NIMBYs.
Oh how I miss Ashmont.
By anon
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 9:36am
Oh how I miss Ashmont.
When was Rozzie "the hood"?
By Waquiot
Thu, 09/17/2015 - 9:57am
Back when you used to shop at Parke Snows? Did your gang get malteds at Brighams?
If you think Rozzie was ever the hood, you had a very sheltered life.
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