Brittany describes the way the guy tried convincing the barista to come back to his hotel room with him (in Allston?), at least, until she intervened:
... I got up, approached the counter, made a face behind his back, and looked at the girl until she told him, "Let me help her." We then proceeded to talk about tea selection and shop hours for long enough that after she was done talking to me, the girl had an excuse to walk to the back of the store without further addressing the dude. He stood around for a while longer but finally had to sit down again. ...
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please
By bostnkid
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 10:53am
sounds like a guy with no game trying to meet a cute girl.if she is old enough to work, she is old enough to rebuff.sounds like some paranoid girls that are afraid of men.im sure this is not the last time a guy will hit on her, she should learn how to handle herself, especially in allston.
Sexual harrassment on the
By o_brien
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 11:23am
Sexual harrassment on the job is against the law. Welcome to the modern era.
Amen
By tblade
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 1:09pm
Amen, o_brien.
and so?
By anon
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 6:12pm
I don't see how any workplace harassment law would apply in this case, unless the skeevy guy was the barista's boss.
Fortunately or not, no law prevents you from engaging someone in a conversation, no matter how bad you might be at it.
The barista was being exceptionally professional in not telling the guy to shove off.
Agreed, learn some quick retorts and shame the guy
By kelly
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 9:26pm
Gotta agree with bostnkid, the woman who was being asked the creepy questions needs to learn to defend herself. No cafe clerk or manager has to be nice to goons. The guy was a weirdo, and once she figured that out, she should have said something like "I'm not interested in talking to you anymore," "You're being a creep, leave me alone or I call the cops" or "Did you really just ask me to go to hotel with you?!" And say it loudly. Don't just let the guy keep going on! I wouldn't have done the "polite distraction" move either. Call the guy on it, and draw public attention to him.
Something is wrong here that young women are so clueless and defenseless. Nobody has to be nice to a pervert.
Or just "I'm married".
By Ron Newman
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 9:40pm
Nothing wrong with telling a little lie to get out of a situation like this one.
why did you link to this tripe?
By Brett
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 11:38am
I was at Downtown Crossing heading to a meeting down a side street when a guy yelled, "HEY BABY!" I turned around, but he wasn't even looking back at me anymore. It's not like this encounter ruined my day or hurt me, but what pisses me off is that I looked. He has that power over me - all men do - and that by just randomly screaming at me, he can have my undivided attention. And people think a power imbalance doesn't exist. Hah.
Um....what? If some guy is walking down the street and a girl calls out, "Hey handsome!", $500 says he's gonna turn around. There's no "power imbalance" here.
That blog is full of blatant misandry and weird hysterical made-for-Lifetime-Channel stories where somehow our "heroine" is always powerless, terrified, etc.
We have the girl who freaks out because someone walks up to her car and taps on the glass. Maybe he was lost, or needed some help? No, of course not, he's automatically a sexual predator. When she gets inside, does she tell the receptionist there's a creepy dude in the lot so they can call the cops or go check him out? No! And of course, she doesn't feel creeped out telling us where the clinic is that she goes to. And despite suffering from mental disabilities, it doesn't occur to our author that maybe the dude does too, especially if he's in the parking lot of a mental health clinic.
It seems like in every case the author should have called or spoken to the cops, security, etc but doesn't- and admits as such. If some guy at a concert is sexually harassing people, you don't just snap a blurry cameraphone picture of his backside. You go and find the bouncer and tell him what's going on. If some dude is jerking off on the bus, you say "dude, put your **** back in your pants, you pervert!" nice and loud, or you get up and talk to the bus driver immediately.
Curiously, though- our "heroine" ends up calling a friend. What the hell good is having a friend on the other end of the phone going to do? Are they going to shout "STOP!" through the phone if Creepy Dude tries to attack them? Come on!
And what's this crap about women being marginalized? Which gender has near exclusivity on rape and domestic violence assistance, shelters, and so on? Which gender faces more societal pressure to not report domestic violence or rape? Which gender has the odds stacked heavily in their favor in child custody cases? Which gender gets child support payments even if they rape a man? Which gender is heavily protected from workplace discrimination and is boosted by "affirmative action" to the extent that they can be incompetent in their jobs and still untouchable? Which gender can walk into any Massachusetts court with absolutely no evidence except heresay and get a restraining order with the defendant in absentia and with no right to due process?
Are you kidding?
By tblade
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 1:09pm
"Which gender has near exclusivity on rape and domestic violence assistance, shelters, and so on?"
Probably the gender that faces the grossly disproportional incidents of rape and domestic violence! It's not rocket science. Perhaps you have legitimate reasons why you are angry with women, but I don't think things will get better if we have less services for raped and battered women, and by extension, their children.
And you can't compare women whistling at men the same way you can compare men whistling at women. If you want an analogy for a man, it would be more like if a group of bigger, stronger men were whistling at you and calling you "handsome". And having this happen on a daily basis. Or slowing down, staring, and beeping at you. Or hitting on you at your job as a subservient, minimum wage, customer-is-always-right coffee server.
stop with the strawman arguments
By Brett
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 1:56pm
Oh really? Did it occur to you that domestic violence and rape on men is drastically unreported, and that rape reports by women have the highest false report rate of any crime? Can you imagine being a man and trying to go to a police station and report a rape? You'd be laughed at. Yet, it happens. There have been cases where men were raped, there were witnesses who testified that the woman SAID she raped a guy, she ends up pregnant, and she not only isn't charged with rape, she's given child support payments!
I don't think things will get better if we have less services for raped and battered women, and by extension, their children.
Who said anything about less services for women? I just pointed out that there are ONLY services for women. I want services for men, and there aren't any.
Perhaps you have legitimate reasons why you are angry with women,
Who said anything about being angry with women? I'm frustrated that society is so heavily biased against men, and yet women still claim they need special status.
There's a national heath crisis- suicides among young males is orders of magnitude higher than it is for young women, yet we see all sorts of focus on issues like women and eating disorders, yet no effort to find out why young men kill themselves.
How many apartment ads do you see that say "men only"? Who pays less for car insurance? Who gets out of more traffic tickets? Who's constantly belittled in the media for being stupid, violent, and capable of only thinking "with their dicks" much in the same way women used to be ridiculed for being stupid and inferior? Who's expected to pay the way? Give up their seat on the subway for the other gender? How long do I have to go on here to illustrate that in no way does American society treat men and women as equals, and that in fact men are treated widely as inferior?
So, how much alimony do you
By Spatch
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 2:03pm
So, how much alimony do you pay a month?
My favorite part of this
By Michael
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 2:06pm
was the headline, "stop with the strawman arguments". I don't know why; clearly there are enough of those to go around.
that's quite a rant
By Ron Newman
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 2:16pm
from someone who tries to deny being angry.
so now we're into ad hominem?
By Brett
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 3:07pm
How about presenting a legitimate argument, instead of attacking me?
I know..
By tblade
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 2:19pm
"Did it occur to you that domestic violence and rape on men is drastically unreported."
But because gay and straight men do not report their incidents, be it because they are intimidated or because they feel that admitting that they were a victim of such violence threatens their masculinity, doesn't detract from the very real and disproportionately high incidents perpetrated on women. If these incidents against males go unreported, perhaps we should foster a climate where men don't feel like "pussies" for speaking up. As long as men don't come forward, these incidents will remain unreported.
And if you think men are made to feel more "inferior" in todays society and that it's is "biased against men", then you need a dose of reality. There are some things that are indeed biased against men, but those things are far fewer than structural obstacles placed againast women that are a legacy of the past.
And for the sad fact that (assuming what you say is true) young males kill themselves in higher numbers then young females, I'm in whole-hearted agreement that an effort must be made to identify the root cause and eradicate it.
I believe there is a high dose of unhealthy masculinities that push the healthy versions of masculinity aside, and I do think you're correct in saying that many mens issues get pushed aside in favor of feminism. But I think that men who care need to be stronger advocates for addressing mens issues in a positive way instead of tearing down others and positing fallacious arguments. Feminism and a healthy pro-woman agenda exists for a valid reason and has progressed our society in countless ways.
I'll admit that I'm tired of being marketed to as the Bud Light-drinking, bacon eating, shabily dressed, hapless-without-my-hot-tv-wife "everyman". Or the violent neanderthal. I think that there is some truths in your message, but your tone will put-off a lot of people and few people will hear what you are saying. A smart, insightful critique of the issues you raise is infinitely more useful tool then the virulence resonating in your above arguments.
non-sequitur
By DC
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 1:34pm
The original story, where a skeevy guy in Allston crossed multiple lines hitting on a coffee shop girl, has nothing to do with anything you just brought up.
What happened to you that drives you to troll random blog posts looking for any old opportunity to write essays about how oppressed men are and how incompetent women are allowed to keep their jobs?
Something about your story makes me think you were that creepy dude in the parking lot of the mental health clinic.
This is why "Femi-Nazi"
By Mark
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 11:57am
This is why "Femi-Nazi" rings true to some people. "I'm not trying to infantalize you, but you need me to save you."
Huh?
By Brett
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 12:56pm
What does "I'm not trying to infantalize [sic] you, but you need me to save you", mean? I don't follow.
Nazi?
By tblade
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 12:59pm
Awesome.
So a woman helps another woman get out of a situation where the barista is being subjected to repeated unwanted sexual advances and all of a sudden they are femi-nazis? Let's also not forget that the barista is working in the service industry where she not only has the pressure not to escalate the man's level of harassment by being direct, she has the pressure of working under the guise of "the customer is always right", because if she doesn't handle the situation correctly, her stream of income may be jeopardized.
Because tactfully avoiding sexual harassment is equal to the guys who perpetrated the holocaust.
Code Words
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 1:13pm
Words like "misandry" and "feminazi" are like the phrase "I am not a racist but ...". They make it very easy and simple to identify somebody who has serious issues with any challenge to their unearned societal privileges.
bullshit
By Brett
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 1:44pm
Misandry means "hates men", and it's just as valid a term as "misogyny."
And, incidentally, don't place me in the same bin as the idiot who used "feminazi", please.
I know what it *means*
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 3:22pm
Strict dictionary definition, yes, that is correct.
But under the cultural usage definition it means "the man using this term is very likely afraid that women asserting and securing their basic human rights diminishes his unearned privileges"
let's see some examples?
By Brett
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 3:38pm
Because otherwise, you're just attacking men who are standing up for their *own* basic human rights.
I don't feel threatened by anything except feminists who feel that they're entitled to biased legislation, unequal privledges, or denying men their constitutional rights.
Come back when....
By KCMD
Thu, 04/17/2008 - 10:31am
...you are not making thirty cents more per dollar earned than a woman just because you have a penis.
got your own special dictionary?
By anon
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 9:38pm
"under the cultural usage definition"
Really? Whose culture?
You've thrown your own very loaded meaning onto this perfectly fine, useful term. Not the first time you've decided to create your special definition for a word, when the word actually means nothing of the sort.
Feminism 101
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 10:07pm
Perhaps some reading from a perspective other than "feminsts all hate men and want my ballssssss" might enlighten you a bit.
Feminism 101
Ralph Wiggum never harassed no one!
By Fornya
Wed, 04/16/2008 - 3:15pm
"My cat's breath smells like cat food."