By adamg on Wed., 11/1/2017 - 10:45 am
CommonWealth reports MBTA fare collections are down $7 million this year, "caused mainly by people who say in surveys they can’t rely on the service and have cut back on its use."
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Comments
Listen Up Charlie
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 10:50am
You ain't going to make those carbon targets if you force people into cars with your mythological "reasons" for fucking over the MBTA.
We should also tell that Northhampton Idiot in the statehouse
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:23am
Hey - Stanley "Forward Funding" Rosenberg! MAYBE if we stopped SUBSIDIZING your roads in Northhampton and westmass, we would have all the funding we need for the MBTA!
Enjoy your flood damage - don't ask for a drop from us again.
Amherst
By Parkwayne
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:43am
He's from Amherst, not Northampton.
Carry on
Nope
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:59am
He lives in Noho. I can even show you the exact location in google maps.
He went to UMass Amherst. He represents Amherst. He does not live in Amherst.
Report: statewide support for transpo. We need revenue FairShare
By anon
Thu, 11/02/2017 - 12:49am
AKA
By Stevil
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 1:04pm
Westawoostah
Ware? I mean... "Where?"
By Rob
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 1:34pm
Ware?
I mean... "Where?"
There wolf!
By JonT
Thu, 11/02/2017 - 11:22am
Just as a side note, if Ware High School ever changes their mascot from the politically incorrect "Indians" to the Wolves, I will gladly buy a Ware Wolves sweatshirt.
A town
By anon²
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 1:17pm
that relies heavily on state tax dollars.
Maybe the inside 128 representatives can lobby together and put the squeeze in people like him. We spend plenty of investment in Amherst and the five college region, and the PVTA.
It needs to be reciprocal.
Yeah, that 1% statewide sales
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:07pm
Yeah, that 1% statewide sales tax that is dedicated only to roads in Northhampton is really unfair.
Sorry you are so bad at math
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 2:04pm
In 2011 the state coughed up 50 million to repair roadways serving <1 million people.
Think about that.
On a cost per person basis, the roads in WestMass are heavily subsidized by economic activity in the eastern part of the state.
Like our own little red state inside a blue state.
And yet they whine about "subsidizing Boston". As if.
Don't say westmass, just don't.
By section77
Thu, 11/02/2017 - 10:24pm
It makes you sound like a marketing weasel.
the doom loop :(
By SC from JP
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:00am
Crappy service leads to decreased ridership leads to budget problems leads to cuts, resulting in still crappier service and on and on.
But the cycle can run in reverse too... will the new cars be enough to save us?
If it's done right
By Waquiot
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:42am
The cycle can be reversed. This has happened in other cities. Heck, some would be surprised that it happened in Boston (if you go back to the 60s and compare ridership to now.)
Of course, I want to see the ridership numbers. The flaw in the article is that it makes the claim based on surveys that show riders question the reliability of the service. Sometimes the T is the best of a bunch of bad choices. All I know is that the Orange Line is as crowded this year as it was last year.
The presentation to the MBTA
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:03pm
The presentation to the MBTA Control Board suggests a lot of the drop is on the weekends and in the off-peak, so those peak trains may indeed be just as crowded as ever:
https://d3044s2alrsxog.cloudfront.net/sites/defaul...
If the unreliability of the T gets worse and worse,
By mplo
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:12pm
ridership will continue to decline.
I've ended up calling Lyft for a ride to places I've gone to down town, due to the constant delays and unpredictability of the MBTA.
They could make up for the
By Eastie
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:01am
They could make up for the lost revenue if they reduced fare evasions. But they aren't enforced 99% of the time. At my home station alone (Field's Corner), half the people walk through illegally, and the T employees (who see it) do nothing.
They could also get rid of employees who sit in booths and literally do nothing. Seriously - you could stand there for hours watching them and you'd notice they do absolutely *nothing*
Lots of people think that
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:37am
The reality is that it is not cost effective and is a waste of resources.
How many times do we have to go through this? IT DOES NOT SAVE MONEY
Yes, if they could come up
By xie
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:09pm
Yes, if they could come up with a way to stop fare evasions while spending exactly $0, that might help.
That's true too, Eastie.
By mplo
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:17pm
The fact is that many MBTA staffpeople are underworked and overpaid. It's really sickening.
Please stop
By cybah
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:44pm
Please stop with this notion about lost revenue not being collected. Once money is put into the card, it's the T's. We've seen that when the cards expre (the T keeps your cash). The T already has money.. now they can't spend it until it is swiped at a faregate.
But to continually say the T is losing money because of fare evasion is a crock. Most cities move to Proof of Payment, which does not require every user to swipe. Spot checking and heavy fines ensures that people have the fare on their cards... but this is MA.. it's JUST starting to get traction on the green line with all door boarding.
You are aware that these people you talk about are being replaced by a private company by people who make minimum wage?
Also, would YOU stop someone over a 2.25 fare? Nope, not worth getting maced or hurt. Let T police to do something. That is who REALLY should be working on fare evasion, not the gate staff. Not their job, not their responsibility, and frankly, not their liability.
...
By Mr. Bink
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 1:19pm
Good! At least then we're saving money for someone to do nothing!
I guess if the cashier at Roche's doesn't want to try and question the guy walking out of the store with milk, ohhh welllll... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
In all seriousness, if this isn't part of their job then what is? I think the original poster's argument also is that there isn't any money being put on any card/pass by evaders.
...
By bgl
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 2:55pm
I would bet Roche's has a policy against employees attempting to stop/apprehend shoplifters - most companies do as its not worth employees potentially getting hurt/killed/stabbed over $3.29 gallon of milk.
They are there to help people if their fare cards are not working, directions, wheel chairs/disabled persons/etc. They are also there to call/alert the MBTA police of fare evasion if it happens.
99%(probably 100%) of retail
By Murphquake
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 6:03pm
99%(probably 100%) of retail chains prohibit any employee except LP to even question a shop lifter, they'll fire non-LP employees that attempt to stop shoplifters.
....
By Mr. Bink
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 6:21pm
Ok, I'll back off and admit that this probably is retail co's & the like's policy to not get in the way then and I'm wrong. I guess we do live in a world where we do have to assume the worst case scenarios when confronting wrongdoers.
In my younger days, a friend of mine drunkenly swooped in with me at Bunker Hill CC and the MBTA gate rep there rightfully put him in his place and made him pay the fare.
Your apologist views are the
By Eastie
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 1:22pm
Your apologist views are the reason nothing gets better.
For the fare evaders: I'm not talking about people who have "money on a card." I'm talking about person #1 swipes there card, and persons #2 + 3 sneak in behind them through the gates. The "alarm" buzzers notifying you the systems knows people snuck through, but nothing happens to them.
Also: "Not their job, not their responsibility" - then what IS their job? To physically sit there and do nothing?
It just hit me - you're totally a T employee, aren't you???
Hokey...
By whyaduck
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 6:05pm
they are not not doing nothing. I would love to have a person "doing nothing" at, oh say, MIT/Kendall when I have a question. Can't ask someone who is not there. So before you presume and assume, why don't you ask the next "person doing nothing" sitting in a T station booth and ask them what their job is? I will presume and assume you will have an interesting conversation.
Not sure if you are a cube dweller, but if you are, someone is probably assuming and/or presuming that you are sitting in your cube doing nothing from time to time when, actually, you are doing something.
Not true they do nothing.
By Daan
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 3:24pm
I've seen at least one reading a bible in the little booth.
save more money by abolishing the fare system completely.
By cinnamngrl
Thu, 11/02/2017 - 10:19am
The massive amount of equipment and staff needed to collect fares that don't actually pay enough to run the system is the problem.
If the fare was Zero, more people would use it and pollution and traffic would reduce. I don't say free because of course we all pay for it, but it would attract more companies to the area.
Gov Chuck played the MBTA funding to save the big dig. He needs to sprinkle a little more of that financial magic to fix the MBTA funding.
Hopefully
By ChrisInEastie
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:15am
The new orange and red line trains will help a bit.
But the T has also had staffing (both in numbers and apathy) issues for years. Not to mention rider etiquette, especially at rush hour, seems to get worse by the day. Between fare evasion and people getting fed up with having to wait for the next train because of selfish morons with backpacks on or that don’t want to move into the train alone, this isn’t surprising.
Personally, I’ll also note that I work in the Sourh End and connect through Tufts, and 3-4 days a week end up just walking to my office and getting there without ever seeing a Silver Line bus. Used to be the same way with the 66 when I lived in Lower Allston and commuted trough Harvard.
I would imagine Weekend Bustitution has had an effect
By GoSoxGo
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 6:33pm
on revenue.
The Red Line has been interrupted for a few years on weekends, and I have avoided taking the T on those occasions between Cambridge and Boston, except for this year’s Honk!/Oktoberfest.
The same goes for the Orange Line, at both ends of the line. Add in commuter rail Positive Train Control installation, Forest Hills construction, etc. and I can see why the numbers are down.
On the flip side, I see the subway as crowded as ever during many periods. The Orange Line has been running with fewer trains for a long time, meaning wait times are longer and the remaining trains are more crowded. The Red Line has also been running reduced trains on weekends on the parts that have actual service.
My biggest worry is that Baker/Pollack and crew will use these numbers as an excuse to reduce service even more, which is exactly the opposite of what they should be doing.
Improve the service and the schedule, and the riders will return.
Oh man
By ChrisInEastie
Thu, 11/02/2017 - 12:52am
don't even get me started on the bus substitution thing. Went to Harvard for a haircut this past Sat, and opted not to drive because of the game happening at the same time. Tried using the 1 as a workaround and regretted every second of it.
red line bustitution
By hrose
Sat, 11/04/2017 - 7:07am
it never ceased to amaze me that the MBTA wouldn't increase service on the #1 bus when the red line is under bustitution. I even wrote to the MBTA to suggest it once, and got crickets in return.
I think a ton of people are
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:22am
I think a ton of people are using Uber/Lyft for trips that would previously have been on the T. It’s screwing up traffic too.
That may be true to a certain extent, but the staff of the T
By mplo
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:14pm
is really screwing the public by increasing the fare hike without first fixing the various problems on the MBTA.
The amount of double-parking on major streets and in commercial
By GoSoxGo
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 10:15pm
areas is becoming (or has become) downright dangerous.
I think it’s time that we start thinking of eliminating street parking in commercial zones, except for existing handicapped spaces. With the amount of taxi/Uber/Lyft pickups and drop offs, along with delivery vehicles, just convert meters to curbside delivery and loading/unloading zones. Use traffic enforcement to write tickets for those violators and box blockers, rather than meter tickets.
This may help traffic flow and could reduce bike lane blockage. Time to use those parking garages and/or choose a different mode of travel in the city. Maybe we can even get actual bus lanes in some areas.
T fares have doubled over the
By Kinopio
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:28am
T fares have doubled over the last 15 years. Meanwhile the gas tax has gone down thanks to inflation. Obviously if you screw over T riders and coddle drivers some T riders are going to start driving.
If you say the gas tax has gone down
By Waquiot
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:37am
Then you cannot say that T fares have doubled. You cannot index one without indexing the other.
I mean, if we really want to twist figures, the cost of a subway ride (using a Charlie Card) has gone up $1.40 since 1991. That's less than the cost increase of a copy of the Boston Globe during the same period.
If you really really wanna twist figures
By spin_o_rama
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:48am
Remind me how much on-street parking costs in Boston? How much do motorists pay for neighborhood parking permits?
Sure
By Waquiot
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 2:13pm
On street parking rates have more than doubled in recent years, assuming you are just talking about metered parking in the Back Bay. And that will track inflation better than Kinopio's claim. Moreover, they are in use more hours than they were back in the day. Besides, that is City of Boston's transportation policy. We are taking state transportation policies here. You know, like the T and the gas tax.
The $1 fare in 2002 would be
By anon
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:30pm
The $1 fare in 2002 would be worth $1.36 today. So today's CharlieCard fare of $2.25 isn't double -- more like 1.65x.
Fair enough. But you aren't
By Kinopio
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 1:56pm
Fair enough. But you aren't factoring in drivers paying less in tax because of cars getting more miles per gallon.
Since 2000:
Subway fare has gone up $1.40
Gas tax has gone up THREE CENTS!
That is the plainest way of looking at it.
Now, now
By Waquiot
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 2:07pm
I never said the increases were equitable, only that your claim that the gas tax had gone down doesn't hold up to scrutiny any way you slice it (as my guess was that you were factoring inflation into the gas tax while not factoring it in the fare increase.)
Umm
By bgl
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 2:59pm
What? Factoring in inflation into the amount of the MBTA fare increases still show an overall increase in the fare. This doesn't change that when inflation is also factored into the gas tax, it has went down. You simply demonstrated that the MBTA's fares didn't rise as high as the original poster had thought (and not factored in inflation) - that doesn't change anything on the gas side of things.
Yeah, but
By Waquiot
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 3:44pm
If we index for inflation, which is what Kinopio did for the gas tax, the rate of increase for the T fare is less than 100%. If we don't index for inflation, the gas tax rises while T fares double. It was his statement that I found fault with, not the overall concept.
Of course, being a bus and subway guy, I would say that the fares haven't doubled, but I won't, because the baseline should be subway fare by the cheapest fare possible (Charlie Card.)
Cheaper to Drive and Park in Boston
By Matt_J
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:35am
Driving from the south, it is slightly cheaper to drive and park in Boston then it is to take the commuter rail / T and park at the station. This could change of course if they put tolls on 93.
An added bonus is that driving takes off about 45 minutes from my commute, even with all the traffic.
I tried the T for many years, it is just not worth the hassle of late and over crowded trains.
Sounds like they'll fix that soon
By Stevil
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 11:42am
As you note, Tolls on the expressway and 128 and more coming soon to a road near everyone. Can't come soon enough.
been tried before
By Marco
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:05pm
has never succeeded. I don't expect it to succeed this time.
Anyone who has lived in the city for any length of time (beyond 4 year college stay) has seen this coming from a mile away. Service keeps getting worse, people who actually need to be at work on time will seek alternate methods. Winter gets shorter every year, so people can bike longer, combined with more bike lanes, and Hubway continues expanding.
politicians like Baker and Marty like to claim the T isn't that bad, meanwhile the evidence piles up behind them to the contrary. Eventually they will face the fact that government isn't a business mandated to generate profit for shareholders, and that money needs to be poured into the T simply to get it to functional level, without ever CONSIDERING expansion. Any proposals at expansion should be laughed out of the room for the next 20 years at least. After that Metro Boston faces being an underwater city anyhow.
I will believe it when I see it
By bgl
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 12:27pm
Given that they can't add tolls to 93 (or 95/128 really) without Federal approval, I doubt it will happen.
They don't need it
By anon²
Wed, 11/01/2017 - 1:22pm
The fed will just take away fed transportation funding if we do it unilaterally.
More likely, they'll fast track it for negotiations to spend less here, but not take away the majority of funding as has happened in other states.
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