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Apple wants to install steel bollards in front of Back Bay store to reduce odds of fatal crash
By adamg on Wed, 09/13/2023 - 10:19am
![Rendering of proposed bollards](https://www.universalhub.com/files/styles/main_image/public/images/2023/applebollards.jpg?itok=sg1dPxyG)
Proposed bollards on Boylston Street.
The Apple Store, 815 Boylston St. goes before the Back Bay Architectural Commission tomorrow for a review of its plans for bollards in the sidewalk out front to ward off the sort of crash that killed one and injured nearly two dozen at the Apple Store in Hingham last year.
Apple has proposed installation of 10 bollards able to stop a 5,000-lb. pickup smashing into them at 20 m.p.h.
The commission's online meeting begins at 5 p.m.
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A better less costly way
would allow free parking in front do vehicles would act as a barrier and would supply much needed parking in this area.
That stretch of Boylston is
That stretch of Boylston is already 2-hour parking that's free overnight. Not sure how making it free during the day would change anything since those spots are already occupied at all times.
So they should take away
Why should it be free? Why should the people who drive vehicles into pedestrians and buildings get even more hand outs? This is some of the most valuable land in New England. You should be embarrassed to expect so much welfare. The entitlement of drivers is never ending.
the people who park there also shop there
and the money they (over)pay supports the businesses who directly or indirectly pay some of the highest real estate taxes in the US, which is a tremendous benefit to the rest of the City. I walk Newbury and Boylston perhaps once a year, just to see it all. Why do you get bent out of shape about allowing the people who pay for it all to enjoy the experience and have a bit of convenience.
The real problem is lawlessness on our roads…
The lawlessness and utter lack of even basic traffic enforcement has created roads so dangerous that stationary objects, “protected” by curbs and at least ten feet of pavement are now at risk. Imagine being a cyclist and told to share the roads with these people.
The solution is sitting since before 2018 in our State House while people continue to die and damage to private property has become such a real danger costly bollards are now deemed necessary.
Other states have implemented automated cameras to great success with repeated studies showing they improve traffic, make the roads safer for all users, and the streets safer for all — even buildings who don’t wear helmets or aren’t visible enough.
Should be on the street
I don't know why we always choose to take away space from pedestrians when installing bollards to protect them from vehicles.
![IMAGE(https://i.imgur.com/BwHAqoD.jpeg)](data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAAAAACH5BAEKAAEALAAAAAABAAEAAAICTAEAOw==)
Same with trash and recycling bins.
I put mine in the street. Wheelchairs aren’t blocked and garbage collectors can get the stuff.
Yup. Same when we get tons of
Yup. Same when we get tons of snow. I put it in the street. Sidewalks are needed. Parking is a privilege.
What are they worried about?
Who drives their cars into buildings in Boston?
But actually … who is going to drive through two lines of cars (parked, and double-parked) to get to the front door?
Lessons learned
Smart of them to prevent what happened in Hingham. They have lawyers that understand the best way to minimize lawsuits is to prevent the thing altogether
And it's not like they could say "we never saw it coming"
https://www.nbcboston.com/news/local/driver-indicted-on-murder-charge-in...
Maybe a road diet is in order
n/t
Apple heard Lara lost the election
And now that she isn’t in the spotlight anymore will be driving around again.
Hopeful BPD is on alert
Oh nevermind, who am I kidding haha
"Police take notice"
signs make me giggle. Every time.
Is that an imperative or declarative sentence?
I've never been sure, and I've seen those signs for nearly 50 years now.
its all about
the comma. (or lack thereof)
Imperative.
It gives police the property owner’s automatic permission to enter a property, if they see suspicious activity.
Or so a cop once told me.
Then you might chortle if ….
… you saw how a graffiti artist altered a similar sign at one of the community gardens.
The unmarked sign read “NO LOITERING - POLICE TAKE NOTICE”
Now it says “GNOMES LOITERING - POLICE TAKE NOTICE”
Do you think they will?
Also worth noting
the area immediately in front of that building -- a good 12 to 15 feet out-- is one of Boston's famous "hollow sidewalks." Any kind of vehicle on that sidewalk risks ending up in the building's basement. Worked in that building back when it was Copy Cop.
That’s one way to mitigate the risk…
That’s one way to mitigate the risk: have a hidden moat in front of the store, like an old medieval castle, so any “invading” vehicles end up dropping into the pit instead.
(Ideally, the pit would also be full of water, with alligators and piranhas to boot, and the security team on the roof can dump boiling cauldrons, etc.)
This is good thinking
Do piranha eat cars? if not, Apple should have its genetic engineers (I'm sure it has a team of them somewhere) develop ones that do. Fish that eat cars? There's an app for that.
Blondie
Blondie had that song about a man from Mars who ate cars, then moved to eating bars, yeah?
Think it was true?
and sharks
with frickin' lasers. on their heads!
Also worth noting…
That building was never a Copy Cop.
No it was
No it was a CopyCop before it became the apple store.
Reference:
https://www.engadget.com/2006-08-08-even-more-on-the-upcoming-boston-app...
Nope.
They demolished the previous building in 2007❤️
Really?
Does it matter? There was a copy cop in that location, and when it was demolished to make way for a shiny new Apple store, I doubt they filled in the hollow sidewalk.
Am I dreaming this?
Wasn't there some controversy when the store opened about how Apple didn't want bike racks or parking meters installed in front as it would "ruin" the aesthetics of the shop?
I vaguely remember Apple offering to pay the city however much revenue the meters generate in exchange.
So, reactionary security theater?
That thing that I mock the TSA for? Now I get to do it with private industry, too?
Reactionary, Yes
Theater? I'm not so sure. You remember what happened in Hingham, right? https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2023/01/12/hingham-apple-store-re...
more like
Liability theater. I'm guessing their insurance is going up because of the Hingham lawsuits (they're being sued along with the driver) so having the bollards would minimize their liability and likely cost them less in insurance.
What do you mean "now"?
Private companies have been doing this kind of thing for years.
Property Line?
The interesting thing is, I think the property line is the demarcation between the tile and concrete sidewalk, near the end of that red curb where the bicycle is parked (if the online assessing map is close to accurate. Tough to know without overlaying it on a satellite image, but I'm going by adjacent building outlines).
Anyway, if that theory is correct, Apple is proposing to divvy up City of Boston sidewalk. To that end, as suggested earlier in this thread, why not put the bollards closer to the street curb? They would protect both pedestrians and the trees.
Put bike racks here, not bollards
Then they would actually serve a useful purpose.
That’s gotta be one heck of a bike rack…
The problem they’re trying to solve is what happened at the Apple Store at Derby Street in Hingham, where a car smashed over the sidewalk, through some planters, and into the store, coming to a stop halfway into the store after injuring a bunch of people, and killing one of them.
In that incident, the car managed to smash through several of the big wooden tables that Apple uses in their stores, and those tables seem to be_really_ heavy. (Source: I used to work at an Apple Store, and those tables were difficult to budge from their places. The modern versions they’re using have a bunch of hidden hardware for power, Ethernet ports, etc, so I think they got even heavier since my time there.)
I do like the idea of bike racks there, but they have to be strong enough to withstand the force from a large vehicle coming through at like 50mph, which was how fast the Derby Street driver was supposedly going. Bike racks strong enough to withstand that would pretty much end up being the squat, fat bollards shown in the photo here. I can’t remember coming across any like that that also had loops suitable for attaching a bike & lock to, but maybe they exist (or, this being Apple, they could design & build some custom ones…).
Ron is right
Look at their mock-up. If each of those bollards had a loop it would double as a bike rack. These are things which can be purchased.
I don’t want my bike used as a shield.
Bollards on the street, bike rack next, sidewalk unaltered and all of it for pedestrian use.
Oh, no!
Poor Lee’s little bike might get a scratch on it. Waaa waa
Be careful what you wish for, robo.
When you come crashing into the bike rack, I or some other cyclist may be locking up our bike.
Vehicular homicide will cost you more than property damage and reckless driving.
Sounds like you think …
… bike racks don’t serve a purpose otherwise.
But I know what you mean.
Is there an epidemic of
Is there an epidemic of people intentionally ramming their cars into Apple Stores? Or was the Hingham incident a one-off?
If Apple is so concerned with the safety of customers in its stores, then they could just reinforce their stores' glass exteriors with steel and concrete and superthick Lexan.
The Hingham store did get
The Hingham store did get driven into but there has been a rash of cars driving into things like houses.....
Is there any reason to
Is there any reason to suspect that, when this guy in Hingham drove his car into the Apple Store, the fact that it was an Apple Store had something to do with it? If there had been a Dunkin's or a daycare in that spot, would his car not have hit that?
I doubt it. Nothing about the story suggests that he was, for example, motivated by an animus against Apple. So I say keep those bollards off our sidewalk: if Apple is worried about improvised drive-throughs, they can pay to reinforce the front of their store.
Or, in other words, you have
Or, in other words, you have to understand, when you're a building, cars will hit you.
fixed that for you @xyz
When you're a Boston building... fixed that for you @xyz.
they're being sued because of Hingham
the guy doesn't have money, Apple does. They're being blamed for not having more protection at the front of their store (similar to all other stores). Adding bollards is insurance against getting sued again. I'm guessing their insurance co is requiring it or their policies will go up. Also, store reinforce their storefronts by installing bollards.
Dangerous Boylston?
If Apple engineers have determined Boylston is so dangerous then shouldn't city install bollards on all of Boylston? They should forward their scientific data to city hall for review.
This doesn't make sense.
In the Hingham crash, the driver basically had a straight shot at the front of the Apple Store from the parking lot roadway. At the Boylston St. store, a driver would have to be driving down Boylston St. and hook a sharp left in order to hit the front of the store.
The reason for no parking in front of the Apple Store is (probably) because it is directly across from the delivery entrance and loading docks of the building on the opposite side of the street.
Bollards should be much closer to the store
If they are that far away, a driver can still turn from Fairfield Street, drive on the pavement, and smash into the store. Look at the rendering.
Why doesn't the city just
Why doesn't the city just install flex posts that they, Cambridge and Somerville use to create "protected" bike lanes. If it's strong enough to protect a person on a bike it should be enough to protect an inanimate building. Sad that Boston drivers have become so dangerous this is what is being proposed.
why?
a better location would be just put them three inches from the door so only apple store customers are effected by them...
Bike credit
Got to give them credit for including the proper bike for being in front of an Apple store. Looks like a fixie to me, with no brakes.
Several thoughts
I see a lot of speculation in the earlier comments made here by some of the UHub community.
I'm somewhat familiar with the site, having made several visits to the store this year, to get ailing equipment fixed.
I think the Hingham incident is a bit of a red herring. Similar accidents, where a confused driver mistakes the gas pedal for the brake, occur with regular frequency. But they're no more likely to happen in front of an Apple Store than elsewhere.
On the other hand, in California there's apparently been a recent trend of after-hours "smash and grab" robberies, where criminals intentionally drive a vehicle through the glass storefront of a retailer that sells high-value products. Having gained access through the broken glass, the crooks then make off with merchandise from the displays. These usually happen in the wee hours of the morning.
I bet that the real goal of Apple's executives in California is to prevent that kind of robbery, and that they're only mentioning the Hingham incident because it was local, and is fresh on people's minds. I wouldn't be surprised if they plan to install similar bollards in front of many of their stores.
The proposed bollards would be much more attractive than the current condition. In recent months Apple has installed some sort of planters in front of the store, which are clearly temporary and rather ugly. The planters have lights in them, with electrical cables running across the sidewalk. And the planters obviously were put there to keep motor vehicles out.
The property line is indeed about 20 feet in front of Apple's building. Setback regulations in the Back Bay go back to the 1800s; they're probably part of the deed restrictions. There are some elaborate formulas that allow entrance stairways, rounded bays, etc., to project out from the building's main wall. The older neighboring building takes advantage of those exemptions, but Apple doesn't.
The artist's rendering does appear to be misleading about the bollards' location. I assume that they would be right at the property line, on Apple's side of the line. That would also explain why Apple seeks permission from the Back Bay Architectural Commission (which can regulate private property), and not from Public Works (which regulates city sidewalks).
Adding loops on the bollards to let them serve as bike racks would turn them into substantial obstacles to pedestrian traffic.
As for the current situation, there's a Blue Bikes rack directly in front of the store. Within the past year, the sidewalk was extended out into the street -- and the parking lane eliminated -- so that the Blue Bikes stand is now on the extended sidewalk. The current Google Street View, dated November 2022, shows that construction in progress. Some earlier Street View photos show the Blue Bikes stand in the former parking lane. The current Google Maps satellite view is also too old to show the new, extended sidewalk.
There is also a mid-block, signaled crosswalk across Boylston directly in front of the Apple Store's east end, and there is a wide curb cut at that crosswalk to allow wheelchair use.
The bollards should probably
The bollards should probably be much closer to the building front and windows.
The rendering right now makes it look like someone could drive up the sidewalk and behind the posts to the unprotected storefront as easily as making a direct turn from the street across the sidewalk at the store.
...
Besides the notion of safety security liability responsiveness post-Hingham... Could this location be getting this attention out of some thought for the possibilities of another Marathon bombing someday?