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Citizen complaint of the day: Sandwich boards on Charles Street spiraling out of control
By adamg on Thu, 07/21/2011 - 8:49pm
An incensed Beacon Hill resident or visitor complains:
Huge sandwich board sign on Charles Street. There are almost 2 dozen from Charles Circle to Beacon Street. I believe they are against Boston Sign Code. Now as one store owner sets one up, they are proliferating down the street. Please warn owners. Thank you.
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Comments
Puh-Leeze
and this is ALL people in beacon hill have to complain about?
They really should leave the city more often....
All stuff starts small
I disagree completely.
If you come down lightly on small acts of antisocial behavior, then you establish a culture in which it's clear that antisocial behavior is not tolerated, and then you pretty much never need to come down hard on large acts of antisocial behavior.
The time to get someone back in line is early, when a polite request will suffice, and not later, when you start needing lawsuits, cops, enforcement agencies and the like.
slipery slopes
are a long time logical fallacy.
Just sayin'
Sidewalk is for walking on
Consider this: Boston is already pretty hard to navigate in a wheelchair, with all the utility poles just jammed into the sidewalk, bad pavement, etc. The sandwich boards make it difficult for two people walking in opposite directions to pass each other, let alone a chair or scooter or someone using a cane.
They take up sidewalk space and impede mobility. It is an issue in some areas, and I now see that I'm not the only person who has noticed.
maybe its time to widen the
maybe its time to widen the sidewalks? charles street doesn't really need to have 3 lanes heading in one direction
charles street doesn't really
Yes it does. So many delivery trucks double park on that street. "Enforce the existing laws!!!" you say. We all know that WON'T HAPPEN. So, for the sake of car drivers (who are just as important as pedestrians, you might need to remember), let's not go crazy here. Ban restaurant advertising on narrow sidewalks, or attempt an insane project to widen the sidewalk? Not much of a difficult choice.
Its a local collector, not an artery
If you could take Charles Street straight past the common to Boylston and beyond into the south end I'd be inclined to agree with you. As it is, all non-local traffic on Charles Street from the circle ends up either at Beacon and Arlington, heading south or east, or at the top of Beacon Hill, proceeding down to Tremont at either Park or School or Somerset.
All of those points are easily accessed by multi-lane, major arteries directly from the circle: Storrow to Arlington, or Cambridge to Tremont.
I don't disagree about the loading trucks, but they are essential to what Charles Street is to the city, a retail corridor based on foot traffic. Like Hanover or Newbury, its value to the city is not a route for through traffic, but for getting local traffic into and out of the neighborhood, and to let people walk amongst all the shops once they are there.
Agreed
I've started using it to get downtown from where the multiple miles of bike lanes through other cities just suddenly and stupidly end at the Boston side of the Longfellow bridge.
This is not an arterial in any way, shape, or form. It could have wider sidewalks, a bike lane (cyclists just take the whole right lane as it is and nobody has an issue with that), and place for active loading. I rarely see cars more than two deep at the lights, or even taking more than a lane.
Parking
I'm not even sure I'm against trucks double parking and parked in bike lanes. Most neighborhoods in this backwards city only allow deliveries 7am to 5pm!
Where else and how else are they supposed to get goods into the city?
The double parking is a direct effect of overzealous residents who don't understand that a city involves things going on at night that might make a tiny bit of noise.
Backwards city
Translation: In formulating policy on delivery, the city government takes into account the the people who live in a neighborhood, not just the businesses that operate there. That approach is part of why Boston is so often held up as a shining example of a city that has successfully maintained a high quality of residential life in a mixed residential - retail - office downtown.
you need to visit more cities
If you think that's true.
Redesign Charles St
There is an effort to redesign Charles St. As with many things in this part of the world, it will take years and there are a lot of competing interests.
I don't know the status of three lanes on Charles St. I think you need them just to handle the double parkers. It is pretty common to have only one lane that is truly open.
Oh Great
After the Clusterbomb that is Cambridge street - with no bike lanes on a critical pathway and a brick planter in the middle taking up too much space and making motorists think they are entitled to a divided highway - I sincerly hope they will hire some professionals and not create another stupid traffic sewer mess.
I seem to remember...
I seem to remember that an the late 70s they changed the direction of traffic on Charles Street from South-North to the North-South as we know it today. Does anyone know if I am correct in this? I don't recall what the reason was. Maybe I'm thinking of another street, but I'm almost certain it was Charles. It seemed a strange thing to do.
Classic Boston stunt
Kevin White was tired of traffic heading onto Beacon Hill, so one night he just had the DPW reverse the flow of traffic, put up new signs, etc., and voila!
That's an odd solution
Widen the sidewalks because people are illegally blocking it with signs?
If people were stealing something other than space.... if, say, landscapers were digging up the topsoil from Boston Common and carting it away, would your solution be to stop them? Or would it be "maybe the city should put out piles of topsoil so that they could help themselves without inconveniencing the rest of us?"
Of course not.
Oh no, there are tons of other things people in Beacon Hill complain about. Haven't you ever read the Beacon Hill Times? It's like a non-satirical version of The Onion.
You are not kidding
I just called up the Beacon Hill Times Web site, and the headline for the lead article is:
BHCA Requests Removal of Synthetic Material from Mt. Vernon St. Tree-pits in Fall:
Stay after the small stuff
The reason Beacon Hill has brick sidewalks (which I know some people hate, but the whole look seems to bring a lot of tourist dollars) is because 75 years ago, annoying, NIMBY busybodies stood in the way of the city ripping it up and replacing it all with concrete. The reaso Beacon Hill has 19th century buildings, and doesn't look like, say, a suburb of Dallas, is because annoying, NIMBY busybodies stood in the way of developers and got the neighborhood declared a historic district.
People like to plant flowers in the tree pits. It makes the neighborhood look nice.
The city came around, without asking anybody, and started covering th dirt in the tree pits with some kind of annoying plastic crap that makes it impossible to plant flowers. Annoying NIMBY busybodies made them stop.
The free market speaks pretty loudly. People will sacrifice convenience and pay a lot of money to live in Beacon Hill, in large part because annoying NIMBY busybodies have put in the work it takes to look after stuff.
Breaking News
I like the "Breaking News" section.
Looks like nothing has been "breaking"
since 12/2010 and even then I'm wondering
why that type of news would be considered
"breaking".
However, I suppose if John Kerry had been
bitten by a dying squirrel in Louisberg
Square that might just make the grade. :=).
Beacon Hill Times
Yeah, the neighborhood used to have two good papers run by residents who cared about journalism. They covered interesting stuff of local relevance (cultural events, local politics, trials and tribulations of dealing with an old house, kids' softball games, etc..) and they had thoughtful essays on the sort of issues that come up when large numbers of people share a small amount of space. One of the editors' health turned bad and she closed the paper; the other sold her interest to a company that runs multiple community newspapers and they cut way back on writing staff, with predictable results: press releases, excessive focus on the BH Civic Association (because they're smart enough to provide stories and copy, which is what these low-budget papers crave), and bland editorials.
This is why
we can't have nice things.
NOT EVERYBODY
has a trust fund. Some need to protect their investment in a small business that maker BH a great place to live. Times are tough on retailers or haven't you heard? Stop complaining and take in a foster kid or two.
Huh?
I'm on your side.
"Protect investment"?
The whole "everyone on Beacon Hill has a trust fund" line is really lame. I live on BH and I'll bet I've got more subsidized housing on my block than you have on yours.
I'm astounded that people are actually defending the practice of helping oneself to public property. That's not "protecting your investment," it's stealing.
If the merchants were running extension cords out to lampposts and helping themselves to the public's electricity, would you make the same argument? That they're just "protecting their investment in a small business"? What if, instead of paying unemployment and workers' comp for their employees, they were dumping the burden onto the public instead, by paying under the table? Same argument there? Maybe a florist, instead of buying wholesale, could just go harvest flowers from the Public Garden.
Slobs of Beacon Hill
For one of the most expensive places in the country to live, BH has a tendency to look like a trash pit. People leave their trash for many hours on the sidewalk. Additionally there is little effort to clean up the trash that appears on the street by most residents.
The sidewalk signs are just another item that gives BH a bit of a trashy look. I understand the retailers need, but I hope they can do more to make the signs look good. A few just end up lying on the sidewalk, providing yet another obstacle for people to walk around.
This IS why we can't have nice things..
Yup I agree. This is why we CANT have anything nice.
And save me the handicapped or 'trip hazard' argument. Save it for when you're complaining about the brick sidewalks that are all around the city. You can see a sign from far away, not uneven brick.
I just think folks in beacon hill have too much time on their hands if this is all they can complain about.
And we wonder why boston ISNT a world class city, because we have too many busybodies who are concerned about NIMBYism and property values than anything else.
Its a sign folks, get over it. Once again the elite have spoken.. and its always their way. Always.
Don't you have some community meeting to attend to that is trying to ban something or prevent some commercial business from opening?
What's your point?
I'm sorry you're offended by people asking that their neighbors obey the frickin' law and move their junk off the sidewalk.
Yeah, it's just a damn sign. If you don't think it's any big deal, then by all means invite the businesses to erect their billboards on your property, rent-free. But not on our public property, thank you.
I'm offended by people grabbing something that ain't theirs, and I think that every time someone tries to appropriate public property for his own private commercial use, whether it's a megadeveloper trying to privatize a street or an ordinary schmuck trying to paste advertising on a signpost, they need to be slapped down.
You seem to have a bug up your backside about civic engagement and about people giving enough of a damn about their surroundings to actually submit public comments, show up at meetings, and otherwise hold their government accountable for doing its damn job.
When somebody's in the process of, say, stealing something of yours, or spraying graffitti on your house, and someone else sees it happening, you want them to do anything? Or do you want them to mind their own business and keep their busybody nose out of yours?
Not to Mention
Charles Street does have uneven brick sidewalks.
Dude
It's a small sign on a sidewalk.
You know whats not illegal? Hiring some dude or a bum to put one on that you can wear and stand outside on the sidewalk all day.
I suggest these businesses do that, and see how much the kings and queens up on BH complain about that.
Lets get some perspective here.
Kings and Queens
I'm really sorry that you're buying the Boston Herald's whole phony class war thing that seems to come up every time Beacon Hill is mentioned.
I can assure you that the students, retirees, people in subsidized housing, people in AIDS housing, people in elderly housing, convenience store clerks, artists, house painters, park wardens, home health care aids, library staffers, and others who I personally know who live in Beacon Hill are not, and do not think of themselves, as "Kings and Queens"
I've seen it first hand
When they banded together to force landlords to stop renting to young professionals and Suffolk kids.
and lets not forget all the perks and extra taxpayer money that gets spent up there, vs other neighborhoods where it go to better use.
How so?
"Banding together?" Heaven forfend that people with a common interest should work together. It's so much easier for corporations to maintain their rightful position at the helm if those pesky citizens wouldn't keep getting in the way.
"Force?" If I recall, there wasn't any force involved, it involved talking to the landlords, and then asking people to take the time and effort to call in violations to ISD and behavior complaints to the police rather than ignore them.
"young professionals and Suffolk kids?" I don't think that was the request, I think it was more like, "please stop renting to people who have drunken yelling matches at 3 in the morning and who piss in the street."
You need to get over yourself.
There are some very well to do people in BH, but there are many more who need to work everyday and not just a few who live in subsidised housing. They all benefit from BH looking better and being easier to move around in.
of course this person is
of course this person is cowardly hiding behind an "anon" ID.
First off, yeah they broke the law, maybe let the BRA deal with this on their own. I mean god for bid that this crap stay up longer than a few moments.
Secondly, when someone steals something or spray paints, I call the police. Not CitizensConnect. There's a clear difference here in the level of urgency.
No I don't have a bug up my ass about civic engagement. Complaining about signs is NOT civic engagement, its about being just a snotty bitch and complaining about something just because you can in a few clicks. Mind your own damn business and let the city inspectors do their job.
This is why CitizensConnect is a bad thing, because it turns into (and I am sure adamg can attest to this) a medium for everyone to just bitch about everything. If there was no CitizensConnect, how would this have been done? Nada. Whoever wrote this would have had to put a ton more work into trying to complain heard, rather than flip out their iPhone and launch CitizensConnect. They probably wouldn't have bothered and just left it alone for the city to take care of in all in good time.
I DO however have a bug up my ass when the elite try to pass off "civic engagement" as driving home their personal agenda. This whole thing about sandwich signs isn't about handicapped access, or people walking, its about "I dont like the way the sign looks and I am going to complain like a child and complain to Mommy Menino about it". And this is just one of many similar typed complains from the BackBay and Beacon Hill. (aesthetic complaints are the most common complaint in these neighborhoods)
And folks, the city sidewalk is JUST as much the business owner's as it is yours. And in some respects it IS the business owner's area, as he pays to keep that spot trash and snow free year round. So you're telling me he can't keep a sign there, yet must PAY (out of his own pocket) to shovel the sidewalk so it is free of snow? Again if it this is a PUBLIC sidewalk, why doesn't the city do this themselves, since it is a public safety issue (as y'all put it).
I get that trash and snow removal is everyone's job to make the city safe and clean, however, you can't go off and saying "well that spot really isn't theirs" when you force them to clean up that same area on their own dime.
Once again, the elite have spoken.. it may not make any common sense... but they have spoken and aired their view. Its all about NIMBYism, nothing more, nothing less.
it's PUBLIC PROPERTY
It's just as much the business owner's as it is mine. That means that neither of us have the right to store our personal junk on it, or to try to convert it to our private use.
Umm... whole point of citizens' connect?
Umm... isn't that the entire purpose of Citizen's connect? To allow ordinary people who spot something that needs to be fixed (a broken streetlight, a pothole, a code violation) to report it so that the city can deal with it?
Mr. brave anonymous "Cybah", where do you draw the line between reporting a problem and "bitching". Pothole? Broken street light? Graffitti? Illegal trash dumping? Abandoned car blocking hydrant? Illegal construction? Illegal posting of advertising on city property?
Cleaning sidewalks
What on earth would it mean for "the city to do this themselves?"
There are only two ways to get the snow removed:
The building owner is paying for it either way.
We (the voters, acting through our government) believe that our internal labor cost structure is better than the city's (i.e. we can shovel it ourselves or hire a kid or a property management company to do it cheaper than the city can get the same job done.) And we can get it done faster: A snowstorm is a classic case of surge demand: Each of us doing it ourselves puts tens of thousands of people to work shoveling sidewalks after a storm; the city couldn't possibly have tens of thousands of snow shovelers on the payroll without killing us at tax time.
One Suggestion, Cybah
Why don't you join in with an architecture and urban planning class the next time the home work is "try to navigate the city in a wheelchair".
I double dog dare you.
Some of these jokers place these signs for MAXIMUM traffic disruption so you will SEE it.
While I agree that brick sidewalks are stupid in this climate and the sidewalks do need to be widened and utility companies and cities and towns should be prevented from just sticking poles wherever they want in the middle of a sidewalk, THERE IS STILL A PROBLEM HERE. A problem aside from the nonconforming nature of these sign boards.
I'm sure you would be the first to scream if you had to drive around one erected in the middle of the roadway.
Wheelchair access is all the
Wheelchair access is all the same. Pathways must be 36" wide. Ramps must be in 1" incline = 1 foot of ramp (so a incline of 12".. the ramp would be 12 feet long. Pathways must be a uniform, flat surface, free of obstruction. That's all you really need to know.
OK Swirly you DO got me on this one, but ONLY because this complaint doesn't say how LARGE the sign is. And I'll be honest, I usually don't go walking down Charles street often enough to notice what's going on. So okay ya got me, I didn't realize they were blocking the entire sidewalk.
ADA reeks havoc on BH
ADA requirements has some pretty funny implications in BH. There are places where the city went and resent the curb to allow wheeled vehicles get to the sidewalk. However you can't go 5 feet before the passable width of the side walk is less then 18 inches.
There are very few places in BH that have long sections of sidewalk 36 inches wide including most of Charles St.
I agree using the wheelchair argument to complain about the sandwich signs is completely off base.
I agree
This is a major concern, but lets not pretend that this is the just fight these folks are looking for.
Charles street is not navigable in a wheel chair period because of the uneven brick and cobblestone. Hell, I sometimes have problems just walking down it without twisting an ankle, or stubbing a toe.
If that was their main concern, they'd be after the city to re lay both sides of the street, put in ramps and fix the gutters. I don't see any calls for that.
See Something...Move Something
Since the signs are already illegally placed is it illegal to fold the signs and lean them against the building? The business owner will of course complain but their complaint is empty.
As for the business owners acting as though the public space is theirs this is an issue that goes way beyond sandwich boards on sidewalks. Here is a list of some ways that public spaces have become extensions of private space:
1. Cell phone conversations in parks, on subways, buses and any other public space which is audible by anyone other than the actual speaker. This includes cell phone conversations at counters where the clerk on the other side of the counter is treated with contempt because they are treated as though they are a machine.
2. MP3 players and any other electronic device audible by anyone on a subway or bus or any other public space
3. Parking on sidewalks
4. Fast bike riding on sidewalks - in busy business areas
5. Unleashed dogs in well used parks
Public spaces will always fluctuate in their temporary use for private functions. In the past most folks used discretion and didn't abuse the privilege. Now the privilege seems to be viewed as a right to use any public space as an extension of an individual's personal property - and to utterly ignore the peaceful use by others.
Let us not forget suped up
Let us not forget suped up four wheel drive baby strollers, so selfish
let Beacon Hill be Beacon Hill
Personally I like having at least one ritzy historical neighborhood in the city of Boston to visit. Beacon Hill is upper crusty with beautiful brick buildings, mansions, tree-lined brick sidewalks and old gas lanterns. I'd like it to stay that way. If it takes snobbery and NIMBYism on the part of residents, then so be it!
like parking space savers?
Isn't putting out one of these signs kind of like putting out a cone or a chair to save "your" parking space?
Shouldn't the city just treat them the same way: toss them in the trash truck and, if the owner can be identified, write him a ticket for improper disposal?