By adamg on Sat., 4/30/2016 - 1:40 pm
The remains of the scooter. Photo by dd808.
Around 11:30 a.m. at Beacon and Charles streets. WCVB reports a passenger on the scooter survived, but was rushed to the hospital.
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Safety
By anon
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 1:59pm
Condolences to the family and friends.
Has someone studied safety of those duck boats in street collisions? That bumper looks pretty high for pushing a car rather than riding up over it, and especially dangerous for bicyclists, mopeds, motorcycles.
They create dangerous conditions
By SwirlyGrrl
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 3:34pm
There are several reasons that I would like to get rid of these monstrosities:
1. they really are not designed for anyone's safety - drivers don't seem to see what's directly in front of them and often abruptly weave or change lanes without regard for vehicles which are right next to them.
2. I have seen these and the boats operated by the original operators and other tour operators for many years. Many of their drivers simply do not respect the rules of the road and the conditions that they operate in. There are two crosswalks on State Street where I've seen them barrel through without so much as noticing that people are walking in them - and they probably can't see those people from the cab.
3. The drivers are constantly distracted by their tour-blather stream and some are using hand-held PAs, meaning one-hand driving.
It isn't limited to the ducks, either - those fake trolley things have similar issues.
And those Super Ducks
By anon
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 4:31pm
are even worse.
Original operators?
By Anon
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 4:32pm
You mean, the army in the 1940s? Care to sell me that time machine of yours?
rolls eyes
By SwirlyGrrl
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 10:45pm
Original tour operators, ducks.
QUACK! QUACK!
Because it's the driver's fault?
By Stevil
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 4:55pm
Why? Because his vehicle is bigger? Size matters? Not blaming either side, but why do you always immediately blame the driver 5 seconds after an accident?
Well
By BostonDog
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 5:38pm
The duck boat crushed the woman, not the other way around. From a physics sense, the duck boat is the object which indisputably ended the woman's life.
So by that logic
By Stevil
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 9:35pm
If a person throws themself in front of a moving train and dies it's the train's fault s/he is dead? Physics.
I never seem to see this
By anon
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 6:10pm
I never seem to see this logic consistently applied when for example someone walks or drives onto train tracks and gets hit.
Inference
By SwirlyGrrl
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 10:41pm
Is an art. Projection is not inference.
I never said that this incident was the driver's fault. I'd put money on it, but we don't know all the details. My main point is that these vehicles are inherently unsafe in an urban environment and not fit for the purposes that they are being used for. Ditto for the fake trolleys. In both cases, the drivers are so busy misinterpreting history for tourists and putting on their show that they fail to do their primary job, which is to drive safely.
The old school duckboats do a pretty good job, and their having long-tenure drivers helps a lot, but they still ignore walk lights and crosswalks and gun lights at times. The Other "duck" boats and their drivers are pretty lousy overall when it comes to paying attention and following road rules, and they seem to be very bad with the blind spots. Those stupid fake trolleys should just drive into the harbor and sink.
There needs to be a comprehensive standard for tour vehicles operating in an inter-urban area, including driver training and not having the driver narrate the tour, and some enforcement of the road laws, too.
Yeah right
By Stevil
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 3:31am
Your meanings are as transparent as Donald Trump's.
We knew what you meant and you even state it in your 4th sentence. Apparently I'm a Rembrandt of inference at least when it comes to your posts.
Projection is for movies.
As for your opinion that these are inherently unsafe vehicles, which is your opinion about everything bigger than a bicycle, where are your stats to back this up? If that were true, how would they stay in biz? They wouldn't be able to get insurance for any reasonable rate if at all.
The duck boats have been around by the dozens plying city streets for about 2 decades. Are they mowing down people and vehicles? My guess is no more than anyone else given that you rarely hear about it and Duck Boat accidents tend to be news.
Eye witness accounts say that Stevil can go bite himself
By SwirlyGrrl
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 6:45pm
The driver ducked up horribly, didn't pay attention, didn't look, hit the accelerator when the light changed and ran the scooter down.
http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2016/04/30/boston...
You can fuck off and die now. Or go cross on a walk light when one of these things wants to turn and the driver is in full quacked up blather.
Your first sentence might be
By Rob
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 12:19am
Your first sentence might be right...
...or you could take a deep breath, calm down, and read the part of the article where the police say they're gathering all the evidence to try to determine exactly what happened and figure out if there's any chargeable offense involved in this.
Looking at some photos (including some with the articles on this crash), I see that the Ducks are equipped with parabolic mirrors similar to what you see on school buses these days. I wouldn't be astonished if one of the critical points of the investigation is whether or not the mirrors were properly adjusted for whichever blind spots they're intended to minimize.
the images in those mirrors
By john smith
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 11:33pm
the images in those mirrors are so small, and the mirrors so far away from the driver that the driver might not see a pedestrian or bicycle or scooter. This happened on a bright, clear, sunny day in spring. On a day like today, when the conditions are worse and everything is gray, and water drops are sticking to the windshield and to the mirror surfaces, the driver probably would not see the images in the mirrors.
A major factor in this death now appears to be the duck boat driver not using his mirrors and being unaware of his surroundings.
I'd ban duck boats from the streets of Boston. This death and other accidents around the country and many more to come, should be enough to stop these, at least in Boston.
You can see mirrors and a
By Rob
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 1:03am
You can see mirrors and a little bit of how they show what's down in front in this shot aboard one duck boat: http://melrosemirror.media.mit.edu/servlet/pluto?s...
Oh do shut up
By lbb
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 8:38am
Got a mouse in your pocket? You speak for yourself, you don't speak for anyone else.
Read her 4th sentence
By Stevil
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 9:04am
She says this just about every time something like this happens before all the facts are gathered. I "inferred" what she meant because this is a pattern of (bad) behavior. Then she proved me right. Then she tripled down.
No
By SwirlyGrrl
Tue, 05/03/2016 - 7:56am
But seeing a psych might help you with your hallucinations. And your obsessions/compulsions, too.
I don't see you going after the other posters below who basically said exactly the same things.
Because
By Stevil
Tue, 05/03/2016 - 8:49am
You make a habit of immediately blaming the driver - plus I don't feel an urgent need to make the same point to multiple posters.
no - because we've all seen them on the street
By anon
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 6:55pm
The driver shouldn't also be the tour guide and the tour guide shouldn't be driving. They're mainly concerned about entertaining the people on board, including making eye contact, rather than the road. Not sure how this is legal but may this will force something finally. They all do it. Boston is not a city you can drive distracted and these operators are super distracted trying to be entertaining. Surprised accidents don't happen more often.
Many times I've seen them
By Felicity
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 6:14pm
Many times I've seen them make reckless right turns from Cambridge St onto Staniford.
Of course your observations
By Cityposter
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 9:54am
Of course your observations are anecdotal. Yet, I've seen the duck boats run the light many times at the very same light where the accident happened. Yesterday's accident likely wasn't driver error and may stem from a lack of visibility because the driver of the gargantuan vehicle couldn't see the bright shiny red Vespa. So, I recommend 1. banning the driver and the vehicle after a traffic infraction for a financially painful period and 2. signage plastered on the duck boat that says keep a distance of 50 feet.
These duck boats should be
By ZA
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 8:22pm
These duck boats should be banned on city streets, it's like the width of a crane going 40 mph down Charles street, yes the width of a crane usually when a crane truck drives down a city street it is accompanied by a car right behind it. These vehicles are classified as military vehicles they are not made to be on a public road..
hmm
By Scumquistador
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 2:30am
yea, no military vehicles should be on the interstates either. eisenhower was a fool!!!!!!!!!!!
They have an aisle down the
By Rob
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 11:53pm
They have an aisle down the middle and seat two people on either side of the aisle, so... they're about the size of a bus. They fit in the normal lanes, too.
http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/boston-duck-tours-7...
But in a bus the driver has
By BlackKat
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 10:01am
But in a bus the driver has pretty excellent frontwards visibility, what with the giant windshield and all. Duck Boat drivers can not see anything directly in front of the vehicle due to the prow. I've almost gotten in the same situation as the scooter driver, but on a bicycle, because the driver can't see anything unless it is at least 10 feet or more in front of the duck boat.
There are similar blind spot
By Rob
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 10:25am
There are similar blind spot issues with school buses (and absurdly large SUVs).
For school buses, they use parabolic mirrors to minimize the blind spots.
The Duck Boats appear to do the same. See the photo link in my comment you were replying to, as well as this photo I linked in a comment elsewhere in the thread: http://melrosemirror.media.mit.edu/servlet/pluto?s...
(good luck with the absurdly large SUVs)
Mirrors Only Work If You Look At Them
By BlackKat
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 11:43am
Because you are not too busy telling your passengers incorrect historical facts and making them quack.
But regardless its a matter of scale too. The prow of a duckboat is about 10x more vision obscuring due to height and shape than the front of a truck, bus, or SUV.
Confusion
By mg
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 2:09pm
The headline says the rider died but the body of the text says she died. Which is it? Or was it Schrodinger's scooter rider?
Driver died
By adamg
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 2:14pm
Driver was a woman. Her passenger, a man, was rushed to Mass. General.
Thanks
By mg
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 2:40pm
Clearly I shouldn't comment before adequate caffeine kicks in.
zero vision
By darrylljfernald
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 2:34pm
It's time that no one dies on our streets. It should not happen.
There are ways
By Kathode
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 3:54pm
to minimize risk but no way to eliminate it.
Why are these military style
By anon
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 3:36pm
Why are these military style vehicles on our streets to begin with?
Tourists love them. These
By anon
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 8:19pm
Tourists love them. These things have no business on a narrow busy pedestrian street like Charles and neither do those god-awful double-decker tourist monstrosities with the huge ads on the sides.
Wrap everything in bubble wrap
By pnwn
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 8:15pm
I drive one of those "god-awful double-decker tourist monstrosities with the huge ads on the sides" They help us show off the city you supposedly love. The one that is a world class city that is rich in history and was the place that our country began. If it weren't for these vehicles the visitors would have a much more difficult time seeing the sights and would not come to Boston and support local businesses where they spend their money and help make your city the vibrant, popular place that it is today.
Thirty years ago tour options in town were limited. As these companies began to operate and grow, so too, did the city itself. The drivers are well trained, the vehicles inspected daily and safety is a priority. Accidents happen.Sadly this one was tragic and thankfully a very, very rare occurrence. Banning tour busses will do nothing to change that. Your logic would mean we should then also ban all large vehicles. If that is the case, good luck having a world class city.
Yes, the streets of Boston are narrow. Narrow streets maybe a contributing factor but if all people, bike riders and pedestrians included, followed the rules accidents would be much less likely to occur. But even if you wrapped everything and everyone in bubble wrap and went two miles per hour, accidents will happen. That is what this was. An accident.
Probably safe but...
By Phyzzi
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 12:18am
I am sure your safety record is fine, but:
1) I am sure those blue man group and legal seafood ads are putting money in someone's pocket, but 'helping the local economy' might be a stretch... I think decent jobs for local drivers are good, but the ads don't seem like some great social boon.
2) narration while driving is distracted driving. What WOULD be good for the local economy is if the historical aspect of these tours went to some college kid or whatever while the drivers focused on driving. Raise your prices and blame the city.
3) Defending a safe driving record in Boston is a little funny anyway as I am not actually sure BPD actually tickets for moving violations. I have never heard of it within city limits anyway, and besides
3.5) we have all had to swerve to avoid commercial drivers several times. Part of the percieved safety of these vehicles is that most local drivers just back off... which is good, but scews the record on safety away from the reality of it.
And then I wonder about pollution in the off season when much emptier buses run the same routes for the sake of stability.
Still, i honetly think most of these drivers are probably pretty okay to very good, and I think we have a lot of other drivers to worry about first (though the whole narration while driving thing bothers me profoundly when I witness it). Honestly, I would be much more happy to see the T start self driving (so an operator can't let it start moving as he gets off) than go after our tourism, as justifiably anoid as many locals are about certain aspect of that industry.
Who benefits and who pays?
By lbb
Mon, 05/02/2016 - 8:46am
A stretch indeed. The next time anyone wants to make the case of tourist-focused business "helping the local economy", I'd like to see them provide a breakdown of where the money goes.
Maybe, but as you point out, how would we know? As you yourself pointed out, where moving violations are concerned in Boston, absence of evidence (citations) is not evidence of absence. I also agree with others who have said that there are certain streets and intersections where these vehicles simply do not belong. If that means that your guests have to get off and go a block out of their way to see certain historic sites, so be it.
Charles Street is narrow
By anon_wd
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 9:13pm
Charles Street is narrow compared to what else around there?
What narrow pedestrian street
By Rob
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 11:20pm
What narrow pedestrian street are you talking about?
Charles Street is one-way, three or four lanes wide plus parking (except maybe one or two blocks that look like they're wide enough for three lanes but I can't see the lines), plus sidewalks that range from "decent" to "wide"
One of most dangerous things on Boston's streets.
By CabbieCarl
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 5:42pm
I drove a taxi for 31 years in Boston. Retired and now Uber a few hours daily. Cabs get a (deserved) bad rap, but in all honesty, over the years some of the most dangerous/scary things I witnessed were these duck boats. I had said for years that they should have one person as the "guide"/host/comedian whatever, and another to drive the boat - and DRIVE IT, period. Instead you have a driver yapping away, joking, pointing out sights along the way. Society is worried about "distracted drivers", yet these Duck Boat drivers are also conducting tours as they're driving.
Example: If you're riding down Beacon Street, approaching the intersection of Charles, where this happened, yet the example could happen anywhere, how can you POSSIBLY be fully focused on the road (and the pedestrians/bikes/motorcycles/scooters/all of the other aspects of city life/etc) while still "entertaining" your riders, pointing out "and over there is the Frog Pond and it looks like there are several people out there today and..."
(WHAM!! SCREECH!!!!! "OH MY GOD"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
"Oops, are you OK Miss Scooter driver? Excuse me....Miss Scooter driver??
If I were the Mayor I would
By Jimmy from Char...
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 8:29pm
If I were the Mayor I would banned these monsterous duck boats immediately!!
These owners are making a killing, and their drivers speed down the streets of Boston. I see them all the time going over speed limit, sometimes I think one day a duck boat will crash onto a sidewalk full of people.
Boston mayor ban duck boats?
By anon
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 12:19am
During Menino, duck boats were the friends of the mayor, trotted out for PR parades.
That's all these vehicles are
By Jimmy from Char...
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 8:21pm
That's all these vehicles are good for , the parades, other than that , they should be only allowed either on the Boston harbor or Charles River, these vehicles are so wide and extremely tall , making it extremely difficult for the drivers of the vehicles to see pedestrians crossing in front of it, how does something like this pass mass inspection, someone is greasing the palms of politicians up on beacon hill.
the owners are making a killing
By Scumquistador
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 2:32am
so are their boats!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"These owners are making a
By fredly
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 8:53am
"These owners are making a killing"
Oh no!!!! Quick, somebody's making a profit! Stop them!
A reasonable accomodation
By Lecil
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 11:34pm
I'm not in favor of banning the Duck Boats from Boston streets, but I can whole-hardheartedly get behind a regulation which demands that there be separate guides and drivers. This seems to be just common sense.
That is the law
By anon
Sun, 05/01/2016 - 2:59pm
in other cities: one to drive, one to talk.
I don't know why it's not the law in Boston, given Boston's love of making rules.
I'm generally pro driver
By Maybe
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 7:19pm
And I think there's an anti-driver sentiment in Boston that's counterproductive. That said, I think we can all agree these vehicles are a menace and we should get them off the road. I've been cut off by them using just about every mode of transit - I can only honk when I'm driving, and when you do that, the drivers do this obnoxious thing where they encourage the riders to quack in response.
They put drivers, cyclists, and pedestrians in danger, and for what? To entertain tourists that would have a fun trip here anyway? There are plenty of other ways to get out on the charles/harbor. I would recommend a kayak or canoe, but the T or shuttles (or, ugh, booze cruises) will take you there.
There was a high profile accident in Seattle last summer where multiple people were killed by one of these. It's time to shelve them. Keep them in drydock and pull them out for parades/etc, but get the beasts off the road. The duck boats are not the reason people visit Boston - it's just something they do while they're here that makes our lives worse.
Dangerous DUCKS
By Anon
Sat, 04/30/2016 - 10:15pm
I know. They hit a man a few years ago. He was walking. A driver lost control and hit several vehicles. A woman posing for a picture fell off the DUCK. They settled out of court and the news. She died.
On the water they have had a few accidents as well. Involving young kids learning to sail.
They have crashed into the bridge, sheared off the top. Broken down in the water.
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