The Globe reports a federal judge found the "the treatment is the only adequate care for his serious mental illness, gender identity disorder."
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Comments
Except
By Lecil
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 11:05am
This is not a life-saving procedure. It may be a life enhancing procedure, but yeah, that is where I draw the line for someone who is a convicted murderer.
Not at all true
By Kaz
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 11:34am
Many people who suffer from this are suicidal. They express that they would rather die than be forced to continue as the wrong gender. If this procedure enables them to silence those demons, is that not life saving?
Them's the breaks dude
By JP-Stonybrook
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 11:58am
Lot's of people are suicidal about a lot things. Maybe killing his wife and spending the rest of his life in prison has something to do with his depression?
How bout this: If it's that important to you that he get this surgery without paying for it himself, then you can start a fund-raising drive for him. People can willingly donate the funds and see if the DOC will allow him the surgery as long as they don't have to pay for it. Maybe some sympathetic doctors will donate their services. Otherwise, this guy needs to be kept physically healthy, safe from being harmed by other inmates, given access to psychotherapy, and that's it.
Predictable, but not persuasive, argument
By Lecil
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 12:34pm
We won't have to look far to find someone who is suicidal because they're doing a life-term in jail. You're not going to argue that they need to be released because it is cruel and unusual punishment to keep them confined?
Don't put words in my mouth
By Kaz
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 1:17pm
We confine convicted criminals for multiple retributivism (punishment for their act) and utilitarianism (prevent further crime by them and as a warning to others) justifications that are acceptable to society. However, you are advocating for someone to be forced to suffer mental anguish above and beyond any response they have to their incarceration.
Does it make you feel proud to cause another human to suffer in your name? I choose to live in a society where inmates suffer due to their choices in life, not their mental illnesses.
False dichotomy
By anon
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 3:45pm
Those are not mutually exclusive.
I do not believe that inmates should be denied decent medical care.
At the same time, I don't have a problem with the concept that, once you have murdered someone, the range and breadth and quality of medical care options become quite a bit more limited.
Here's an example; I'm not 100% sure I have it fully thought through, but....
Arthritis can be managed either through joint replacement or by reducing or eliminating physical activity. For a person on Medicare, reducing or eliminating physical activity is an unreasonable burden, and it severely limits the quality of life. I'm happy to buy a new knee or a new hip for someone on medicare. For a prisoner serving a life sentence, on the other hand, there is no benefit in having the prisoner be physically able or active, and so managing the pain by restricting physical activity is a reasonable treatment. Note that I'm not suggesting that the prisoner be made to suffer physical pain, only that his desire to be physically mobile not be something the rest of us need to pay to satisfy.
So, is gender identity disorder something like arthritis, in which the suffering can be managed some other way? For example, by eliminating social interactions? Or is the pain and suffering so intrinsic that it can only be relieved surgically?
Yeah, it's not like 90+% of
By anon
Fri, 09/07/2012 - 3:11am
Yeah, it's not like 90+% of inmates are going to be released from prison some day and have to be able to work.
Oh wait.
Well, even if we were to cripple them through restricting their opportunity for physical activity for years at a time or denying them prophylactic treatment of progressive degenerative joint illnesses, they can just sign up for SSDI and live on a disability check. That'll be fine, right?
I'm all for psychiatric help
By Lecil
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 5:04pm
But I am not going for a highly invasive, radical, surgical intervention for which there is still a high level of controversy over the efficacy of.
Controversy is waning
By Kaz
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 6:22pm
The AMA and the APA (see above quote and link) are rapidly forming preferred treatment guidelines that include gender reassignment surgery for those people suffering with GID who meet a lengthy set of criteria outlined in the APA task force report (I took some time to read the review from the task force that was published last year and the surgery isn't something someone does on a whim or without heavy medical and psychiatric doctors' inputs).
There have been limited "outcome studies" due to the emergence of the treatment as an option, but what limited data there was showed the task force good reason to make this a preferred treatment for the patient.
It basically comes down to
By Finn
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 9:57am
It basically comes down to this - even though you commit premeditated murder, the taxpayers will pay for your life-long dream?
life-long dream?
By John-W
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 10:22am
It's medical treatment, not a trip to Disney World.
I guess the issue is whether one thinks sex re-assignment surgery/treatment is necessary medical treatment. Kaz and Eeka have made good arguments that it is. Others have said no, although their arguments are more along the lines of "you're a murderer, you don't get treatment" or "youze a prevert, this isn't a medical condition to be concerned about, but a sick choice of yours, you prevert."
Do insurance companies typically cover this procedure/process? (process, as it's not just an aggressive circumcision, there's a lot of pre-post work as well, as I understand from the increased coverage of this in the media). This is kind of cutting edge (arf arf) in terms of what our society is capable of digesting. Same sex marriage is still bunching panties across the nation, so it's understandable that something like this is going to evoke even more extreme reactions.
I honestly am not sure about it (in terms of the State paying for it for inmates - does it do so for others?).
Yes, of course you're right -
By Finn
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 1:02pm
Yes, of course you're right - sex-re-assignment surgery would never be something people dream about would it? I suppose the ugly-duckling teenager who can't wait to get that nose-job would never dream about having it finally done after years of waiting for it. And like that procedure, I consider this to be elective, cosmetic surgery - failing to operate would not put the subject in jeopardy physically, but it would injure his/her sense of well-being and self-image. I have no problems with people who want transgender surgery - if the surgery will help them be happy, I'm all for it. I don't consider transexuals 'preverts' - however, I consider convicted murders to be.
Since the subject's condition of being born in the wrong type of body is in no way a result of any kind of failure on the part of the State, the State cannot be compelled to remedy or alter the subject's physical makeup through surgery at tax-payer expense unless the subject can prove that failure to take surgical action would immediately harm the subject's physical well-being. Mental or emotional well-being should not enter into incarceration, or any State-sanctioned punishment in general, unless it can be proved the State is unlawfully engaging in cruel and unusual mental and emotional punishment either through action or inaction, which, it could be legally argued, could be anything from verbal harassment to taking away teddy bears.
So as far as I can tell from
By anon
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 2:30pm
So as far as I can tell from a lot of comments here, the reaction seems to be transphobia with a big dash of that good ol' American lust for vengeance in the treatment of prisoners?
Lust for vengeance?
By Nancy
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 5:18pm
I think that Michelle can live out the rest of her life as a pre-op tg just like many other women who can't afford the full gender reassignment do.
I don't perceive this as lust for vengeance at all. I see it as a judge bending over backwards to make a very expensive accommodation for someone who committed murder.
The comments made by some
By anon
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 8:49pm
The comments made by some here about how, as far as they're concerned, prisoners forfeit all rights when they're convicted of a crime tells me otherwise. This is some Dirty Harry shit.
Straw man much?
By anon
Wed, 09/05/2012 - 9:49pm
Prisoners forfeit some rights when they're sentenced to life in prison without parole.
I have read the decision and I agree with much that's in it. But to me, life without parole remains a special case. I would support gender reassignment surgery for a prisoner whom we expected to release back into society; it is in society's interest to have this person exit prison as whole and as complete a human being as is possible. In this case, not so.
Yeesh
By Kaz
Thu, 09/06/2012 - 8:58am
Seriously? You can't see why someone who is sentenced to life without parole wouldn't need to be treated the same as someone who has a 10 year sentence?
Go back and study your 8th Amendment. Even the lowest among us need to be treated respectfully. You wouldn't advocate mental torture for him would you? I mean we don't have to worry about him exiting prison as a whole and complete being, so why not screw with his mind? We might learn something new for science...yeah, that's the ticket. He's gone as far as society's concerned anyways, right?
I'm not advocating torture
By anon
Thu, 09/06/2012 - 3:02pm
I'm absolutely not advocating letting someone languish with an untreated / unmanaged medical condition, which is essentially the same thing as torture.
But treatment for someone on the outside (restore full function by replacing the arthritic knee joint) might be different than treatment for someone on the inside (relieve the pain of arthritis by avoiding excessive walking). There may, or may not, be an analogous choice in the case of gender identity disorder.
Economical alternative
By Sock_Puppet
Fri, 09/07/2012 - 5:59am
DIY, $23.21 with standard shipping.
Too merciful for a killer
By Dan Farnkoff
Thu, 09/06/2012 - 5:55pm
Unfortunate that the test case for this couldn't have been a burglar or a gentle tax-evader or something.
Is imprisonment in the wrong body that much more cruel than the imprisonment of the body experienced by all lifers, and all the associated privations and indignities? Psychological torture is an inescapable part of a long prison term, one of many reasons it's not advisable to kill other people.
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