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Check out the paint scheme on this new Green Line trolley
By adamg on Thu, 10/22/2015 - 10:43pm
From the flier.
In the early 1970s, the MBTA launched an ambitious effort to upgrade the Riverside Line that included reconstructing the tracks and the purchase of 150 new trolleys from Boeing Vertol. Jed Hresko found a flier from those halcyon days that included a description of the new cars:
Features of the Light Rail Vehicles include: Improved riding comfort with air-conditioning in Summer and reliable heat in Winter, fluorescent lighting, and tinted windows; greater speeds; smooth starting and stopping; a public address system and two-way radios, and reduced noise and vibration.
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Comments
I Miss The Boeings — They Were Nicer Than Their Successors!
Also in fashionable orange! — Their motors made a lovely sound when starting up!
Not as nice as their successors
I remember George Sanborn at the State Transportation Library explained to me why the Type 8s (?) we're better. One example you see in this shot- the doors. The early Boeing doors were horrible.
But don't get me started on the low floor trolleys. Yes, they are ADA compliant, but horrible for about everyone else.
BIG EDIT- I meant type 7s. The subsequent discussion has convinced me of it. Sure, I should have named the manufacturer, but if I put "Kinki" I would have felt dirty somehow.
The Bredas Never Gave Birth
When new, the Boeings had plenty of problems — as you mentioned, the original doors were horribly designed with too many parts that proved unreliable. But after all the bugs were worked out, they really were quite pleasant, and much more modern looking that the Kinki Sharyos that followed.
The Bredas had terrible problems with their wheels when new, and were prone to derailing. Eventually, sections of track had to be modified before they could be used. Then, they just crept along at a snails pace; I still don't think they operate at was was supposed to be their full speed. I also hate the screeching, loud alarm that beeps before and while the doors are closing — it's not nice at all!
Disappointingly, and despite being mated with Kinki cars as well as their own kind, the Bredas never had any children.
Me Too
Yeah, I don't like that too. But unlike the track and/or wheelbase, the door closing tones can be changed easily for free by a technician. So, umm, why haven't they? Yet another example of where Germany has this problem solved - the sound isn't nearly as annoying yet still distinctive enough to know to stand back.
The sound should be
the same as a T bus, which was obviously inspired by Gizmo:
The T is kind of like that
If you add too much water or any frozen water - the T turns into one giant gremlin
Not only that
but the Bredas greatly reduced the reliability of the Kinkis, thanks to that idiotic "compromise" whereby the MBTA allowed Breda to gut and replace the control systems on the Type 7s with the Type 8 control system, instead of requiring the Type 8 control system to be compatible with the Type 7s in the first place.
Of course, the Type 8 order should have gone to Kinki Sharyo instead of Breda (proven design, compatible parts inventory, etc). But that's what you get by having idiotic procurement laws and badly written specifications.
They didn't replace the
They didn't replace the control system, the Type 7 modification was to install multiplex cables on the couplers so that the two car types could communicate. The Type 7s retained the same DC chopper control system they always had. It is the control system on the Type 8s that adjusts its acceleration/deacceleration rates to match the Type 7s when running in trains together..
Thanks for the clarification
However, my point still stands. The Type 8 specification called for modifying an existing fleet to work with the new cars instead of requiring the new cars to work with the existing fleet.
Can you say bass-ackwards?
And Type 7s and Type 8s have never played well together, despite the modifications to "insure compatibility". Unless you think that "let's shut the train down to reset the systems" - which happens with increasing regularity on the Green Line - is supposed to be a routine operational mode.
But There's A Tradeoff ...
... between spending more money on the new cars, to make them 100% compatible with the old ones; and spending (hopefully) less money to do modest retrofitting of the old cars, to make them (somewhat) compatible with the new ones.
Three for the price of one , 1966 +/-
20th century?
Looking at that double trackwork between the roads I am reminded that when I visited Amsterdam a couple of years ago, their downtown street track was largely "gantlet" (or "gauntlet") style track. Essentially instead of side by side tracks, the tracks are laid one inside the other - so they overlap. Then they split at station stops so the trolleys can pass each other - much more space efficient allowing for green space, bike lanes etc.
Does require better scheduling/coordination which could be a problem around here - but, for all points west of Mass Ave - might be an improvement.
Too bold for Boston?
Methinks frost heaves here
Methinks frost heaves here would be a problem with that kind of setup.
Makes sense to me
Let's replace every foot of track and replace every last car because of something you saw in Amsterdam. We probably need to legalize hash first so that it makes sense.
poke fun at Stevil and I'll laugh
You can poke fun at Stevil and I'll laugh. At the same time, the Dutch, the Danes and the Swedes have been making advancements in transit, inter-city and urban transportation design that puts our progress to shame.
We invented drive-your-car-to-work-from-the-suburbs to the city paradigm. But now Americans want to live in the city car-free, well not car free but Uber, ZipCar or rentals will do.
We don't have to re-invent Dutch and Scandanavian urban transpo infrastructure designs innovated and evolved since the early 1900's, we just have to commit to spending to implement them. We know we need to spend upwards of $8 billion on the MBTA so spend wisely.
BTW, european transportation designs and investment for cycling weren't always the case. The people convinced the government to build it. The energy crisis in the 70s made the Dutch and Danes and etc glad they did. A lot of people cycle to work and schools, about 30% of the population. A lot of people take public transit, which isn't thought of as welfare for poor people.
We sure spend a lot of money on roads, funded by local, state and federal revenue and rarely tolled. I read somewhere the subsidy for public transit riders is about 20% greater than auto drivers. At the same time greater Boston produces 70% of Mass' GDP.
Tell you what
When the number of commuters riding bicycles greatly outnumbers the number of commuters riding streetcars, then we'll consider a plan that frees up more space for bike lanes while decreasing safety for transit users (gantlet track = possible head on crash).
(No subject)
It doesn't take a design
It doesn't take a design degree to see that parallel horizontal lines are pleasing to the eye. Look how all the windows line up, and the green stripe is a straight line.
Now compare it with the proposed Type 9 designs in the survey: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/vehiclesurvey2015
The low floor design probably dictates the mismatched windows. But why does the green stripe have to hang a right at Albuquerque and take a left at Cleveland Circle?