New trains still on track; manufacturer builds scale model of an Orange Line car
MBTA officials recently told the T's Financial Control Board that work to get long suffering Red and Orange Line riders into new cars is currently on schedule - with the first new Orange Line to go into service in, well, early 2019.
The T is expected to take delivery of a mock-up car for review in January, with the first actual running test car sent our way in December of 2018. It will then go on the rails for several months of testing before its doors are first opened to the public. The first test Red Line train is expected to come a year later and also undergo several months of testing.
After that, the T will get roughly four new cars a month for each line until all are delivered and in service by the end of 2022.
CRRC, a Chinese rail-car manufacturer, will be assembling 152 Orange Line cars and 132 Red Line cars in a factory in Springfield. The T is spending $729 million on the new cars.
Ooh: Shiny, slidey seats like on the Blue Line in this Orange Line mockup:
Shiny computer simulation of a new Red Line car:
H/t Tim Lawrence, who posted copies of the relevant documents.
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Comments
Typo?
Is there supposed to be an estimate of the amount of cars we'll get monthly? "After that, the T will get roughly new cars a month for each line until all are delivered and in service by the end of 2022."
Does anyone know if the new cars will fix the signal issues? Or is that a separate issue?
Sorry
It's four new cars a month for each line ...
As for the signal problems, separate issues.
The new cars may at least
The new cars may at least alleviate some of the capacity issues, because they'll have better braking ability, thus allowing them to adjust the signal system to space trains closer together. But that's only possible once all the old trains on each line are replaced, and is a somewhat separate issues from the new trains themselves. There are also some reliability issues with the signal system itself, although I hear that the work they've been doing to replace cables has helped considerably, and indeed it's been a while since I've seen trains abruptly jerk to a halt for no apparent reason between Central and Harvard, which had previous been something of a trouble spot.
I hate those stupid slick
I hate those stupid slick seats. Always end up smooshing into people when the car breaks or accelerates.
They should provide a more
They should provide a more comfortable place to sleep though.
Nah
I'm a fan, since with the slick seats you can tell when they're wet.
Several of my friends have taken a seat on the orange line only to find themselves sitting in a surprise puddle. One time it was definitely not just water...
agree
I was one of those people. Now I test the seat before I sit down.
Bring back the padded vinyl.
Bring back the padded vinyl. It was comfortable, visible when wet, and easy to clean and sanitize.
They are awesome
When they don't have dividers, you don't get sat on or have "half" empty seats.
Instead you have gaps of
Instead you have gaps of various sizes, without it clearly indicating that there's a whole seat available.
Lmao
Thank you so much for your comment, I haven't had a good laugh all holiday weekend.
You made my new week started on the good foot.
How could it possibly take
How could it possibly take "several months" to test them? We needed these things years ago so they should stop taking their sweet ass time.
How could it possibly take
Um, Boeing LRV, Breda Type 8. Just two examples of what can happen when you DON'T allocate proper time for testing before releasing equipment for revenue service.
While I have some issues with the overall schedule for the new Orange and Red Line cars - especially the "the manufacturer is required to construct a new production plant in Massachusetts before starting ANY construction" idiocy, allowing for adequate prototype testing is ALWAYS a good thing.
Burn-In period
New trains can have bugs even when they meet all specifications of the blue prints. Let's remember that some assembly is taking place elsewhere, not in Springfield. Some of the body parts will be built in China and elsewhere in the world, and shipped here for the full final assembly. The plant is assembling sub-assemblies made in different locations. This is the same process when building an automobile.
The first test trains will be run on the 3rd track between Community College and Wellington on the Orange Line. All of them, including the new Reds. The 3rd track was to be used for local service with the middle track (now the outbound track) would be used for express service in either direction during peak hours. That never manifest so the 3rd outter track is now used for testing of trains when delivered.
The current Blue Line fleet was tested there early on.
Once the bugs are documented they fall back and determine what needs to be fixed and then retrofit anything already in production. This can be anything from something mechanical to a software issue.
Once resolved, they test again to make certain all is well. This process can take several weeks or even months especially if additional bugs or manufacturing flaws are found. It's a wash, rinse, and repeat process.
Then once they have all of the bugs worked out, and the production delivery starts, the trains received will again undergo testing in non-revenue service (that is to say no passengers and usually off hours) until it is determined they are working to spec and safe for passengers.
All of the new commuter rail coaches and locomotives have been going through the same process by the way.
FWIW, some of this is not just MassDOT and MBTA process but coded in federal regs. These trains will have hundreds of miles on them before the first passenger ever steps on.
Let's also remember the T will have to train their operators in the new controls and "feel" of the new trains as well. They will not be like the current fleet what so ever. The current fleet has a control cab at the end of each car or "A-A---A-A---A-A" configuration. The new fleet will have a blind coach (no control cab) attached. The blind or "B" coach eliminates the control functions of driving and doors which will be activated in the "A" coach. A typical 6-car trainset will be "A-B-B-A-B-A."
Hopefully these new trains will allow reverse movements in the event an operator over-shoots the platform. Otherwise it's a walk to the end of the train as is the case now to back 'er up.
New Airplanes Are Tested More
When a new airplane model is designed (say, Boeing 737-800), four to six are built. Those are tested extensively for 18 to 24 months. Then a Type Certificate is awarded, and aircraft can be sold for 'revenue flights'.
Testing of the T's new cars sounds reasonable.
That computer rendering...
That computer rendering shows a station that is cleaner, nicer, and in better repair than anything we can ever hope for. Would be a great juxtaposition to see the gleaming new car under a backdrop of peeling paint, rust, grime, and general decay. Just so we don't get our hopes up or anything.
Just hope that the bubble gum
Just hope that the bubble gum, rust and duct tape can hold the existing trains together until the new ones are online.
Did anyone else wonder if
Did anyone else wonder if this might be impacted by upcoming changes in trade agreements?
No because they are being
No because they are being built domestically.
Built? They are being
Built? They are being assembled domestically.
Other Concerns
I'm more concerned with massive cuts to public transportation funding. Most public transportation in the US is funded by the feds for capital improvements. The people coming into power have made it clear they don't consider "urban" issues to be important and environmental concerns are meaningless.
Considering they'll be built
Considering they'll be built in the US with US labor and US materials, nope.
The stainless steel shells
The stainless steel shells are to be built in China, with final assembly in Springfield.
Assembled
from parts being shipped from 'away'.
BUT BUT
I VOTED FOR TRUMP SO HE WOULD DONE BRUNG BACK THE JOBS THAT CHINA AND MEXICO HAVE STOLED FROM US AND BRING BACK COAL JOBS TOO BUT THESE RUN ON ELECTRIC BAD WHY WON'T PREMIER TRUMP HELP #MAGA!!!!1!!
</sarcasm, if it wasn't already clear>
Very Unlikely
The arrangements for these cars were made under rules that existed at the time. It's very unlikely that anything in the new rules would change an existing agreement.
Yeah, but...
The only thing I want to know is will the new cars still smell like hot farts during my rush hour commute home?
Yes. The cars may change but
Yes. The cars may change but your fellow commuters won't. Ever.
Are the new cars connected
Are the new cars connected like the Green Line so you can walk from the front to the back of the train or are there doors between each car? Seems like most modern city's have done away with the doors between cars so people don't avoid the ends of the car, removing the bottle necks. Beijing, Shanghai, Hong Kong, and Xi'an all have beautiful modern trains. These images make it look the same as the current fleet but with more plastic and no new ideas...
Look at Hong Kong's new trains: https://www.hongkongfp.com/2015/07/23/mtr-orders-hk6bn-in-china-made-tra...
No, unfortunately, which was
No, unfortunately, which was an idiotic oversight from the MBtA.
That's called an open gangway design, and does amazing things helping crowds move down the train.
NYC just decided to go big on them.
So there's a drivers cab in
So there's a drivers cab in each cart, I'm guessing the is no plan for automated trains either then. The world is going to have self driving cars that can navigate chaotic roads, but our trains still need drivers in 2020 and probably into the next 50 years - brilliant!
Unlike the current cars,
Unlike the current cars, (some of?) the cars in the middle of the train won't have cabs, which will provide a small amount of extra space for passengers.
(We're not going to have self-driving trains any time soon. Nor self-driving cars if my predictions are correct.)
Waitaminnit!!!
Waitaminnit!!!
Orange LIne - only two doors on each side of the car? Not three?
Does any line/system anywhere use rapid transit cars even close to that size with only two doors on each side of the car?
I think that when PATH modernized rolling stock three or four decades ago some of their first orders were two-doors-a-side - but they quickly went to three-door layouts.
Does anybody really think that's a good idea?
I saw that too. Who thought
I saw that too. Who thought that was a good idea? Three doors per side minimum! Sheesh do these people even ride the subway during peak times?
Read more closely
I'm going to admit- I thought that same though first thing, but that is a 2/3 mockup, which (I hope) means 3 doors per side per car.
That said, the Blue Line runs trains with 2 doors per car, though the Red Line goes the other way, with 4 doors per car (per side in all cases, obviously.)
It's like Ronald Reagan in that movie: Where's the rest of me?
You're right, it's not a full-length mockup. This drawing shows three doorways per side.
3 doors per car for OL, 4 for RL
This is a 2/3 mockup. Each car will have 3 doors, which will be significantly wider than the current cars to allow better passenger circulation. The Blue Line has 2 doors because of the short length of the car. Orange line cars (65' long) have three doors. Red Line cars have 3 (for the older 01500s-01700s) or 4 (for the newer 01800s); by 2022 all RL cars should have 4 doors.
(BART only has two doors, an oversight which is being fixed in their new procurement. NYC Subway has three doors even on the IRT cars, which are barely Blue Line-length. Chicago has two doors on their cars, which are Blue Line length. Open gangways would make some sense as well, but more and wider doors should help, too.)
If these work—and with the T's procurement process, that's always an if—they should noticeably improve the functioning of the Red and especially Orange lines.
What is a 2/3 mockup? Are all
What is a 2/3 mockup? Are all the dimensions full-sized except the length?
Normally, all dimensions are
Normally, all dimensions are scaled by 2/3. This however does look like everything is full-size but it's only 2/3 length, which would make it not 2/3 scale.
glad to see they'll still be
glad to see they'll still be hideous.
But But
the color schemes were approved by the passengers (remember that pointless survey). So how in the world can they be hideous?
/s