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The theory was brilliant: Let's make the Red Line resilient
By adamg on Mon, 12/05/2016 - 9:26am
In practice, looks like the Red Line (and the Orange Line) might need some more work. Agiraffes shows us what Quincy Center looked like at 9:15 a.m. due to "minor" delays.
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Comments
I think it is time the T
I think it is time the T tries out demand pricing for ridership during peek times. At rush hour, fares should go up. You could continue to raise them until ridership reaches 100% of line capacity. It would vary from line to line, based on ridership levels. This should help alleviate the congestion on the T during the daily rush hours. Riders could seek alternative forms of transportation such as walking or biking. The funds could be used to fund off hour services that tend to lose more money because of lower ridership. Funds could also be used to improve reliability.
Absolutely!
Screwing over poor people who rely on the T sounds like a great idea.
I'm pretty sure that anyone who has the possibility of avoiding the T during peak hours has already explored those alternatives.
Yes, because raising fares will immediately result in surplus revenue. Jesus H. Christ.
Screwing over the poor people
Screwing over the poor people vs screwing everyone, which one is worse Scratchie? Using your ideology, we should be charging based on income level. Good luck with that.
Everyone will benefit from an increased revenue stream for the T. The T should also charge people per mile. A butt in the seat from Braintree to Alewife increases congestion a great deal more that one from Andrew to S Station. It is very disappointing when riders watch a system deteriorate right before their eyes and are not willing to pay their share to keep the system running.
Yeah
It's all the fault of those selfish riders.
Ayn Rand Team ACTIVATE!
You forget, the purpose of public transit is to make the roads passable to the BMW set.
Pricing the poor off of even the crappy public transit is just being greedy, don't you think? Toss them some table scraps.
passes
I can't tell if you're being serious or mocking the earlier post about increased parking meter rates.
But I'd hazard that most rush hour riders have passes, so how would your fare scheme mesh with unlimited-ride passes?
Maybe passes are only good
Maybe passes are only good under normal conditions. If you want it to be good during a surge you need to get the deluxe pass.
Sorta like the DHS airline pass thing?
Delux Pass
Isn't Delux Pass normally spelled "UBER"
Earth to BigBird, Earth to BigBird...
I do walk on many a night from Kendall Square to South Station due to the Red Line being "delayed" or "dead". So why in heaven's name should I have to pay more to the T do this?
And those who can't walk or ride as easily as I? Hmm?
Let us try to post things that are somewhat connected to some sort of reality, shall we?
same
but your mom
No way, man!
I can't afford that! She's always in high demand!
Mmmmkay
DC already does this.
Fat lotta good it has done for safety, performance, etc.
We need to STOP STARVING AND INTENTIONALLY SCREWING UP OUR PUBLIC AMENITIES THAT WORKING PEOPLE USE SO RICH JERKS CAN HOARD MORE OF OUR MONEY.
DC
DC also has exit fares so you pay for distance traveled in the system (in theory) which is a big difference from Boston. DC also lacks what we consider the Commuter Rail.
Peak fares are not without logic but the two systems are not directly comparable.
The DC area does has commuter rail
Suburbs to the north and west are served by MARC. Suburbs to the south are served by Virginia Railway Express.
The only differences with DC area commuter rail are that the first stations on each line are further out than with the MBTA, and that there are no outlying connector stations between the commuter rail and the Metro system.
The only differences with DC
This is not true at all. VRE also stops at L'Enfant Plaza within the District, and interchanges with Metro at Union Station, L'Enfant Plaza, Crystal City, and Alexandria, along with Franconia-Springfield on the Fredericksburg line only. MARC interchanges with Metro at Union Station, New Carrollton, College Park, Greenbelt, Silver Spring, and Rockville.
DC also lacks what we
No it doesn't. In fact DC has 2 separate agencies running commuter rail, with a total of 5 lines.
VRE runs the Fredericksburg and Manassas lines into Virginia. They are surprisingly busy (daily ridership 17,500 - for comparison, the Framingham/Worcester line up here carries about 16,000 daily riders), despite only offering peak hour service (plus one or two off-peak round trips).
MARC runs the Brunswick, Camden, and Penn lines into Maryland and West Virginia(!). Both the Penn and Camden lines offer bidirectional all-day service (the Brunswick line to WV is peak-only), and the Penn line even uses 125 mph-capable equipment, making it the fastest commuter railroad in North America! Also a respectable daily ridership of 31,300.
Also, to nitpick, DC doesn't charge exit fares. They charge distance-based fares, so you have to swipe your SmarTrip card upon entering and exiting. It calculates your fare and deducts the correct amount upon exiting (if you get out without swiping somehow you're charged a high penalty fare - not sure what DC's is, but most systems charge at least the maximum possible fare). In contrast, exit fares require you to pay a regular fare to enter, and then pay another fare to exit at a certain station, without any regard to distance traveled.
Please, Nitpick
Ridership aside, I wouldn't say peak-only, one directional travel to be the same. The DC CR system is at best a shell of what the MBTA's system it. The flip side is their subways go considerably further into the suburbs.
2 of DC's commuter rail lines
2 of DC's commuter rail lines do offer all-day, bidirectional service, as I've pointed out. It's not the same level of service, but like I also pointed out, they certainly aren't hurting for ridership as a result. The two systems have a combined ridership of about 49,000, which is almost half the MBTA's 120,000.
5 lines with a weekday ridership of 49,000 vs. 13 lines with a weekday ridership of 120,000. I'd hardly call that a shell.
Peek times?
I thought they outlawed the upskirting that had become so prevalent on the T.
Everyone else has already
Everyone else has already pretty thoroughly destroyed this suggestion, but I'd like to add this:
Peak hour ridership is ALREADY at or exceeding 100% of capacity during peak hours. That's a large part of why these delays have gotten so bad.
How would this work though? Would you install faregates at transfer stations, making people tap their card again so they can be charged extra if they're transferring to a busier line? That definitely wouldn't create any bottlenecks downtown.
Anyone who can already does.
If the T implements a peak/off-peak fare structure, it'll be discounted off-peak rides, rather than more expensive peak rides. Incentivizing people to fill empty seats is easier and more effective than disincentivizing people from riding during peak hours. This is likely to happen on the commuter rail before happening on rapid transit though.
Same Thing
What's the difference between raising peak fares relative to off-peak verses raising all fares but then giving off-peak a discount?
My biggest fear is that the MBTA becomes a peak-only system like they've threatened many times before.
Congestion charges for cars
I think it is time the city/state try out demand pricing for road usage during peek times. At rush hour, tolls should go up. You could continue to raise them until usage reaches 100% of road capacity. It would vary from road to road, based on congestion levels. This should help alleviate the congestion on the roads during the daily rush hours. Riders could seek alternative forms of transportation such as carpooling, taking the T or walking or biking.
Couldn't agree with you more
Couldn't agree with you more spinner. If people want to use public road and transportation at peak times, they should pay extra. Cars especially, the revenue could be used for carbon offset programs to help mitigate the extra pollution from sitting in traffic.
It's so sad-- if you think
It's so sad-- if you think about the fact that ridership exceeds capacity even given how crappy the T is, imagine how amazing and built-out our transit system could be if it was actually funded and managed correctly.
I most certainly do not agree
I most certainly do not agree with raising fares during peak hours on the T (which includes buses) because:
1. The network is not spread equitably. I am lucky that I live in between two T stops about 5 mins apart by walking, however there are many of our neighborhoods who can rely only on buses in mixed traffic.
2. Fares, which went up this past summer (except for the bus where it dropped ten cents) are already posing themselves to be a burden for working class and low-income residents and families. I commute to work via bike, but I am also cognizant of the fact that this is still considered to be either a luxury or a burden depending on your income level.
3. Most residents are not going to get on the road until we have a more connected bike network with a greater focus on protected bike lanes. Most people do not want to ride side by side with Boston drivers, and I can't blame them. I've had my own share of near-misses. Biking up from outerlying neighborhoods like West Rox, Hyde Park, and Mattapan can be abysmal.
4. How many residents can actually walk to work from where they live? Yes, Boston is a walker's paradise but if the workplace isn't within a 15 minute walk from someone's home, guess where the average person is going to end up?
Their car.
BigBird - you are
BigBird - you are ridiculous. Not everyone lives within walking distance of where they need to be. Some people who ride the Red Line or Orange Line come from the commuter rail. Should they ride their bike from the suburbs? Moron.
I'm no T apologist but..
The thing is a 100 or so years old, and carries thousands of people every hour. There will be some hiccups. I'm sure that provides little solace for those just trying to get to work or home, but a little perspective might help. Can the T be better, of course. But a moderately delayed (and yes I know a lot of delays aren't moderate) train ride is still better than sitting in traffic for hours on end.And to be clear, I hate the T, but after living in NY for a few months I've come to learn that delays and issues aren't solely happening on the T. In the words of the great BB 'it is what it is.'
T
Please quit it with the canard that we should cut the T slack because it is 100+ years old.
First, most of the T is not 100 years old: what's the excuse when a signal fails at Braintree or at Oak Grove, stations that opened in the '70s and '80s?
Second, it's not the physical tunnel structure that's failing, and it's not as though the track and signals on the Green Line at Boylston date from 1897.
Indeed. The only part of the
Indeed. The only part of the T that is 100+ years old is the masonry in the tunnels. A lot of the T equipment is old, but we're talking years or decades, not 100+ years.
reading these comments about
about raising this raising that , use other ways of transportation .. trying to figure out if you people are giving a legit opinion or are you part of that top 1% that wouldnt mind paying more for a service that may or may not work. if you guys suggesting a raise are dead serious , how bout you write a personal check to the T. and who knows if these ppl suggesting that BS are even from Boston or even take the T regularly ? some douche out in randolph that works in brockton commenting on T prices type of shit . its really difficult to decipher the internet trolls Vs. those people that dont understand an argument from BOTH sides. Simply put : theyre selling you a shitbox car for 500 already , dont up the offer to 1000. and btw i dont even remember the last time i took public transportation , but damn ..
FYI, for those of you that
FYI, for those of you that suggest that the T is only or poor people.... Really?! Not everyone has the luxury to be able to drive. I speak for myself. I don't have the vision required to drive a car. I don't consider myself poor. I rely on the T to get me to work and back home. Enough with the judgments.