By adamg on Mon., 7/12/2021 - 10:00 am
NPR reports the Entomological Society of America is looking to change the name of gypsy moths because the current name is "very hurtful to the Romani people."
The moths are an invasive species, originally imported from Europe in the 1860s by a French artist turned entomologist living in our very own Medford.
Etienne Leopold Trouvelot got it in his head the moths could produce silk rivaling that of the better known silkworms. He was wrong, some of the caterpillars that hatched from the eggs he had sent here escaped and now, every ten years or so, they erupt in a leaf-munching frenzy that denudes millions of trees.
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Comments
Call it the Medford Moth
By BostonDog
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:14am
It's not fair that Lyme, CT gets credit for that illness while Medford can't get any credit for the destructive bug we created. There won't be justice until every farmer and pest control company knows my city's name.
Also, I love the fact the biologist who coined the name "Gypsy Ant" has the last name of McGlynn. While he likely has nothing to do with Medford, the surname McGlynn is well known to all Medfordites as that family had run Medford for decades.
So they should call it the Medford Ant too.
Take that, Lyme!
PS. Bloomberg Moth would be my 2nd pick.
Lyme and Old Lyme?
By anon (not verified)
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 2:48pm
As far as I know, no Lyme nor Old Lyme resident had anything to do with ticks or Lyme disease being present in Connecticut or elsewhere in North America.
To that end, Lyme disease is nothing like the medford moth, which is a menace to our lands entirely because of a poor decision made by a Medford man.
Lymies
By johnmcboston
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 3:36pm
Lyme disease was named after the CT town as that was where the disease was first identified, not because it was created there. The conspiracy bus has it hitting Lyme via deer from Plumb island.
From where?
By perruptor
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 6:07pm
This island, is it made of lead?
Trouveloths?
By bostnkid
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:12am
n/t
We have too many artists
By Notfromboston
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:16am
We have too many artists turned scientists around.
I'm sure there are any number
By coffeeweasel
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:27am
I'm sure there are any number of things they've been called that can't be printed in the newspaper.
I’ve got it!
By Thomas Sullivan (not verified)
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:29am
Call them “Trumpers†because they are awful & cause mass decay.
"very hurtful to the Romani people."
By roadman
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:33am
Is that how the Romain people really feel about the name, or is that just someone's "expert opinion".
Really dude?
By lbb
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:42am
This is a stupid question. Decent people don't wait for complaints to correct their behavior. Either way, a name change is in order.
Survey says 35% of Romani Americans consider the term a slur
By Dot net
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:50am
https://www.washingtonpost.com/science/2021/07/11/...
Here's a link to the study cited: https://cdn1.sph.harvard.edu/wp-content/uploads/si...
But did the survey ask how
By Refugee
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 11:00am
But did the survey ask how they felt about the "gypsy moth caterpillar", "gypsum board", or the Fleetwood Mac song? I doubt it.
Gypsum board doesn't come
By DrewD
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 11:14am
Gypsum board doesn't come from "gypsy".
If you're going to be a dick, you should be more careful with your facts.
Furthermore, every use of a term doesn't need to be explicitly checked. You can't say f*ck on television. We don't need to check if f*ckwit is okay.
It's also a "fact" that
By Refugee
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 12:17pm
It's also a "fact" that intent doesn't matter anymore for racism, apparently. Whether something got its name 200 years for one reason, or 2000 years ago for another reason is trivia. The fact that you have to look up word origins on Wikipedia to decide whether to be offended or not is a good indicator of whether something is actually a real problem or an invented problem.
A couple of years ago someone from California complained that Kansas printed license plates containing the letters "JAP". The plate numbers were obviously randomly generated, but they still offended people, because so many people love discovering things to feel outrage over.
Jap is offensive, though
By tblade
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 12:39pm
Every state has an algorithm to prevent the random generation of offensive 3-letter words like ASS or KKK onto a license plate. If it’s offensive, fix it instead of defending and trivializing it.
Imagine handing a gay person a license plate with 378FAG on it and telling him that he should not be offended because it was unintentional and randomly generated.
In reality this is how things
By DrewD
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 12:45pm
In reality this is how things happen:
RMV: "Here's your plate."
Vehicle Owner: "Hey, this plate is 378FAG... I'm not really comfortable with that."
RMV: *after making you stand in line for a month of course* "Okay, here's another one."
Vehicle Owner: "Thank you, I appreciate that. You should change the algo so this doesn't happen again."
Refugee-from-U-Hub: "WHat iS WrOng With The WoRld!?! I'M NoT rAcisT!"
Imagine handing a gay person
By Refugee
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 12:01am
A more appropriate analogy would be a flamboyant gay man from San Francisco getting the 378FAG plate, driving it east, and then someone from Kansas calling the California DMV complaining about how it is so offensive. That is an example of an invented problem.
Come on
By tblade
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 1:28am
This is example is absurdly dumb on so many levels. What is wrong with you?
just stop posting
By berkleealum
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 7:54am
it’s okay to be wrong
The moth was named using a
By DrewD
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 12:41pm
The moth was named using a racial slur. Even if it wasn't intended it makes sense to change it. Why are you bothered by that?
If I'm in someone's way and they ask me to move, I'll move. I don't get upset because I wasn't intentionally blocking them.
This has nothing to do with license plates. If that issues comes up here, let's discuss it.
Also, I did double check to be sure, but I knew gypsum came from another source (although, I don't know where the name Gypsy came from, so maybe they share a common parent). This has nothing to do with my point at all, but I thought it was funny how cranky you got about that. If it works for you it's a fact; if it works against you it's "trivia".
gypsum
By John-W
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 3:22pm
The word gypsum is derived from the Greek word γÏψος (gypsos), "plaster". (wikipedia)
Late Middle English from Latin, from Greek gupsos. (Oxford Dictionary - Lexico)
Gypsy - as noted above from the mistaken notion that these folks were from Egypt.
Egypt - The name 'Egypt' comes from the Greek Aegyptos which was the Greek pronunciation of the ancient Egyptian name 'Hwt-Ka-Ptah' ("Mansion of the Spirit of Ptah"), originally the name of the city of Memphis. (World History Encyclopedia).
and...
Old English Egipte "the Egyptians," from French Egypte, from Greek Aigyptos "the river Nile, Egypt," from Amarna Hikuptah, corresponding to Egyptian Ha(t)-ka-ptah "temple of the soul of Ptah," the creative god associated with Memphis, the ancient city of Egypt.
Strictly one of the names of Memphis, it was taken by the Greeks as the name of the whole country. The Egyptian name, Kemet, means "black country," possibly in reference to the rich delta soil. The Arabic is Misr, which is derived from Mizraim, the name of a son of Biblical Ham. (Online Etymology Dictionary)
It's Fun to
Find Out!Procrastinate like a Motherfucker!Misr, Mitzrayim
By Ron Newman
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 4:32pm
I was always taught that these names meant "a narrow place", referring to the fact that Egyptian civilization clung tightly to the Nile River. Myth or legend?
(This fails to explain why Mitzrayim is a plural form.)
The only reason
By lbb
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 7:27pm
The only reason someone would be bothered by this is if they want to use racial slurs.
Or they were tired of hearing
By DrewD
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 9:28pm
Or they were tired of hearing other people use racial slurs.
How's that work?
By lbb
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 10:16am
Someone writes a knickers-in-a-knot post over the renaming of the gypsy moth, and this is because...they are tired of hearing other people use racial slurs. How's that work again?
The Entomological Society
By Dot net
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 11:22am
The Entomological Society received a request to change the name. They consulted Romani scholars, including one quite familiar w/ the caterpillar, who had this to say:
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/09/science/gypsy-m...
I don't know why some people need so many reasons cited as to why something is offensive to a group of people. I doubt anyone that didn't see an issue once it was brought up will be persuaded otherwise, which is why I was reluctant to comment on this issue.
By the way, gypsum board is named for the mineral gypsum, from the Greek for plaster, because I guess they saw the Egyptians use it first. It has nothing to do w/ the term that is being discussed here.
Yeah, but I know a guy who's
By DrewD
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 11:24am
Yeah, but I know a guy who's cousin met a guy in a bar who was married to someone who was a quarter Romani. They were totally cool with it so I am deeply offended that they're changing the name.
(/s just in case)
Are you really getting bent
By ZachAndTired
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:55am
Are you really getting bent out of shape that a bug with an ethnic slur for a name is getting renamed?
Perhaps you haven't heard anyone complain
By BostonDog
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:56am
Since a good portion of those people where killed by the Nazis (among others), there's not as many people left to protest.
As a descendant of members of ….
By Lee
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 2:27pm
…. gypsy tribes I can say I have no objection to the word. My ancestors called themselves members of the Kalderash and Savo tribes and the Swedish Travelers (or whatever that is in Swedish). My grandfather called himself part gypsy. I think tabooing words does little to change people perception. It’s just whitewash on a problem.
Oh not this again
By eeka
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 3:25pm
I also have a couple of Black friends who say the n-word is fine for anyone to say in any context.
But since I spend time around more examples of the community than just these two, I am aware that this is a fringe viewpoint, that most people wouldn't appreciate me saying it, and I don't ever say it.
You can find people from pretty much any group who say they don't care if others do things that are considered offensive by many many others.
In other words, folks, please don't take the word of one person on UHub who claims to descend FROM DIFFERENT NOMADIC PEOPLES THAN THE ONES WE'RE DISCUSSING that it's OK to use something that a good number of Romani leaders ask us to not use.
You don’t seem too know …
By Lee
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 4:15pm
… much about the various groups and tribes that fall under the umbrella term “gypsyâ€.
Particularly about the Kalderash. My great grandfather spoke Romani and taught some phrases to my grandfather. He also didn’t feel the need to use all caps to try to convince people of his opinions. He was a great public speaker though. But that’s another story.
I'm curious
By lbb
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 8:00pm
When people see you, are they able to identify you as Romani? If they were to guess at your ethnicity, what do you think they'd say?
Sounds like you’re asking if
By Lee
Wed, 07/14/2021 - 9:58am
Sounds like you’re asking if you can touch my hair.
Names of people
By BostonDog
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 4:55pm
My grandfather was Polish but as a kid I didn't want to tell anyone because of all the Polish jokes. To this day I'm sure there are many adults who think poorly of the Polish for no other reason than the ubiquitous jokes about people from that country.
So even if most adults are smart enough to not think poorly of the Gypsies due to the connection with the moths, it's still a name worth changing.
Are you or any other Gypsy proud about the connection to the moths?
I’m an animal lover.
By Lee
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 5:54pm
Including insects. Well, some (humans, mosquitos…) I don’t like as much as others but I don’t hate any because of their species. Moths are just trying to survive like all living creatures.
Word policing
By StillFromDorchester
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:43am
Is getting carried away.
Any thing they change it to could be offensive to someone.
You don't get to decide what
By Scratchie
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 10:50am
You don't get to decide what's offensive to other people. "Gypsy" is a deeply offensive ethnic slur to Romani people, even though you undoubtedly have no clue.
Who said I get to decide?
By StillFromDorchester
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 11:38am
I said word policing is getting out of hand.
I don't care if they change it or not, this is a place you put your opinions right?
Do you get to tell people who call themselves "gypsies" ( they exist) that it's offensive?
No, but you have an opinion, as do I and it's that word policing is getting out of hand.
I said word policing is
By Scratchie
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 12:19pm
Why is it "out of hand"? When a name is offensive, you change it. It isn't complicated.
If you think that this is an example of "word policing getting out of hand," that implies that you think that this ethnic slur is not worth getting offended over.
Which is the same as saying that you get to decide which offensive terms are offensive enough to warrant a name change, and which name changes are "out of hand," i.e., unnecessary.
Yes, it's just your opinion (ooh! magic word!), but it's a stupid opinion, born of ignorance and privilege.
Thanks
By StillFromDorchester
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 12:39pm
A stranger who knows nothing about me said my opinion is stupid and I'm privileged. Amazing
Your opinion is correct and you are enlightened. Ok?
Yes, it is
By perruptor
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 1:33pm
and yes he is. Also yes, your opinion is stupid, and you act like a privileged nincompoop.
Because you seem determined to ignore the point, it's not Scratchie who's determining that the word is offensive; it's people who are having the word applied to them.
Ok
By StillFromDorchester
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 1:43pm
Thanks for your input.
Really?
By Will LaTulippe
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 1:47pm
What did you think was going to be the outcome of starting a pissing match with Scratchie?
Who?
By StillFromDorchester
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 2:07pm
Am I supposed to know scratchier?
I just put my opinion out there that word policing is getting out of hand..
I found out today I'm a nincompoop and my opinion comes from ignorance and privilege, so at least I learned that.
He's got five UH years on you
By Will LaTulippe
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 2:34pm
So, yes?
Sorry
By StillFromDorchester
Mon, 07/12/2021 - 2:57pm
I'll pay more attention to the screen names.
I know a few
but not everyone
I try not to pay too much
By Lee
Thu, 07/15/2021 - 8:59am
I try not to pay too much attention to the screen names and respond to posts as stand alones on their own merits. Not that I’m very successful at that. Lots of vivid personalities and interesting writing styles here at UHub.
it’s so funny how quick people turn on the waterworks
By berkleealum
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 8:02am
waaaah i said something stupid and you pointed out how stupid the thing i said was; you’re the REAL racist - not ME who expressed my stupid ass racist opinion!
A stranger who knows nothing
By Scratchie
Tue, 07/13/2021 - 9:15am
You stated your opinion publicly. If you don't want other people to know how stupid and privileged you are, it costs nothing to shut up.
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