Other New England states, maybe even New York could join our bubbling revolt against clock changing

This fall, when the change from Daylight Savings to regular time is supposed to happen, the federal government should direct ALL states that observe DST to move the clocks back exactly one half-hour. Then leave the clocks where they are from that point forward.

Having a handful of states follow a different standard than everyone else, especially when it comes to time, is just idiotic. And the fact that our Legislature is WASTING time (pardon the pun).and resources actually debating this is even more idiotic.

Hmmm...interesting idea.

By mplo
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 7:23pm

Moving the clocks a mere half-hour back, or a half-hour a head is an interesting idea. It sounds like a good compromise, too.

Not easier, and not practical

By perruptor
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 8:03pm

Then you'd have people not subject to your order having to calculate half-hours, instead of full hours, to know what time it is in other places, and people who are subject to it having to do the same. Not better, just different.

And just how is calculating half-hours

By roadman
Fri, 03/17/2017 - 1:59pm

any more difficult than calculating hours? Plus, the change would occur only ONCE, thus eliminating this outdated and truly jerky "spring forward, fall back" routine.

DST is truly arbitrary, as proven by the recent change extending the time of year DST is in effect.

No way

By Bugs Bunny
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 8:21pm

I want late sunsets in summer. That'd cost me 30 minutes of light at day's end.

That doesn't solve the problem

By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 10:08pm

That problem being that the eastern time zone is about 300 miles too wide.

where should the border be?

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 11:20am

Should we lop off the eastern or western side of the time zone?

The eastern side

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 2:37pm

Duh.

Ever camp in Maine in the summer? Even with DST you get 3:30 am sun, but 8 pm sunset.

S.A.D.!

By Refugee
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 8:37pm

Clocks change in March: "Daylight Saving Time is the worst idea ever."

Clocks change in November: "Meh."

Can't change this unless New Hampshire and Maine go along

By Ron Newman
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 10:06pm

and probably Rhode Island as well. Vermont would have to decide whether it wants New York or New England time, as it's geographically and economically tied to both places.

Why?

By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 10:27pm

States can decide these things on their own.

because it would be chaotic

By Ron Newman
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 10:37pm

if Massachusetts adopted the same time zone as New Brunswick, but New Hampshire and Maine (which sit in between) stayed with Eastern Time.

Time zones should be contiguous.

It doesn't really matter

By Yeah
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 11:35pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_...(GSP)

Economic activity in the NE USA drops off a lot outside Boston.

If people in Nashua or Providence commuting to Boston have to deal with a time change and they don't want to get on board, well, that's one of the tradeoffs you make to pay less than $300/sqft for real estate.

Someone's gotta lead the way

By LEL
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 11:17pm

Somebody's got to do it first, it might as well be the state with the economic center of New England. Our neighbors have said if we do it they might just follow along: https://nyti.ms/2mzB4QX

Time Zones Aren't That Orderly — Even Within States!

By Elmer
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 11:25pm

Many states have more than one time zone:
   [img=1x15]http://www.universalhub.com/files/uhub215_0_0_1_1....
[img]http://www.timetemperature.com/tzus/united-states-time-zone-map.gif[/img]
   [img=500x1]http://www.universalhub.com/files/uhub215_0_0_1_1....
Canada too, where in Newfoundland it differs by a half hour:
   [img=1x15]http://www.universalhub.com/files/uhub215_0_0_1_1....
    [img]http://www.timetemperature.com/canada/catzmap.gif[/img]

That time I was confused

By Cranky
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 2:19pm

I once drove from Nevada into Arizona, and then into the Navajo Nation, all in one day. I literally had no idea what time it was.

And yet ...

By perruptor
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 3:16pm

You seem to have recovered nicely!

Maine & NH are talking about it already

By avjudge
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 9:32am

Both New Hampshire and Maine have had bills on this introduced this year. New Hampshire's bill ties their change to whether Massachusetts changes.

Oh please! Please! Please!

By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 10:10pm

[img]http://thumbpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/O...

No more 4pm sunsets! Ever!

We must...

By Fenwickian
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 10:52pm

Revolt against the Tyranny of the Morning People!

OMG

By johnmcboston
Wed, 03/15/2017 - 11:07pm

You think we were clubbing baby seals here. It's changing your clock by an hour. Big whoop.

With DST you get the late sunsets people tend to like
With EST you don't have the sun rising at 8 in the morning at the height of winter.

An inconvenience once a year in Spring seems like a better option than being an hour off from the rest of the eastern seaboard...

Yes.

By matthewm
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 6:01am

"An inconvenience once a year in Spring seems like a better option than being an hour off from the rest of the eastern seaboard..."

Bingo.

Even if we make the switch, a lot of folks' work schedules will still follow NY time. That means a lot of hassle at work when we make a switch and NY doesn't. And if folks' working hours still follow NY time, then child care hours will, too. That would be a huge inconvenience (and cost!) to a lot of working people.

You have evidence?

By perruptor
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 7:34am

... a lot of folks' work schedules will still follow NY time.

Who are you talking about - stockbrokers? How many of them are there? I question whether there are "a lot" of those people, and would like you to give some evidence as to why their convenience outweighs the comfort of everybody else.

Personally, I don't care what they do in New York. Also, it's not "an inconvenience once a year in Spring," it's an inconvenience twice a year, and it's stupid. That the rest of the East does something stupid over and over is not a good reason for us to.

Not just stockbrokers

By WalkingTheDog
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 8:40am

Not just stockbrokers but anyone whose schedule aligns with the major financial, business, and government centers of the East Coast such as New York and Washington, D.C. In addition, we would then be 4 hours out of sync with California instead of 3. So for a lot of people, scheduled working hours would have to shift to one hour later to accommodate their employers in other time zones.

Added bonus

By KSquared
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 8:59am

Less traffic coming into the city all at once - if some people really do shift their work schedule by an hour.

You know how I know that you

By tofu
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 8:40am

You know how I know that you don't have kids? Changing clocks is not a 'one-time' inconvenience even for adults. Kids, forget it, takes a week.

Sayre's law

By anon
Thu, 03/23/2017 - 8:35am

Sayre's law. Also see bike-shedding.

Time Zones

By Terrapin
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 8:48am

I vote for getting rid of time zones altogether. What time the clock says it is just doesn't matter. What matters is when people set their working hours and what time local sports games begin. Just because a bank here may open at 8am doesnt mean that a bank in LA needs to open at the same time (which would be in darnkess). They could just open at 11:00.

Time zones only exist because people are too simple to understand differences in clock time and the angle of the sun in different locations.

It was actually about keeping trains running on time

By KSquared
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 9:00am

And having "standard time" for a large country, but thanks for playing

Originally yes

By Terrapin
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 9:52am

OK genius, I get why they were originally established. I just believe they have outlived their usefulness. Not such a racical idea really. China only has 1 time zone.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/post...

And I was walking down the

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 9:31am

And I was walking down the street one day
Being pushed and shoved by people trying to beat the clock, oh, no I just don't know
I don't know
And I said, yes I said
Does anybody really know what time it is
Does anybody really care
If so I can't imagine why
We've all got time enough to cry

Noon is noon

By Scauma
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 9:34am

What you're saying doesn't make sense. Time zones are based on the sun's movement in the sky. Local sports games and when banks open have nothing to do with it.

Try going to Detroit sometime

By fungwah
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 11:22am

Same exact time zone, sun is in a very different place in the sky. The Eastern time zone is huge, mostly for business reasons.

wait, the sun is in a different place?

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 12:16pm

Copernicus rolls over in his grave.

Shorthand

By perruptor
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 1:18pm

Short for "in a different place in the sky at a given clock time." But you knew that, didn't you? And yes, it's true for any change in location.

Noon should be noon

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 5:26pm

Except when it isn't because the time zone puts you off of noon for 19th century railroad reasons.

I've been privately thinking

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 6:29pm

I've been privately thinking this for years. Just have one global time zone for this planet of earth. So in your location "noon" (as in sun's position) might technically be 0603 or 1824, who cares? The number is arbitrary. It's all global now anyway. Easier to say "I have a conference call at 1100 with the office in New Delhi" and have no ambiguity whatsoever, and also say "standard local working hours are 0400-1200" and STILL have no ambiguity.

Lots of businesses already shift their summer and winter hours. It would be no more confusing or difficult than it is now. Just different.

If the change is to be national...

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 9:13am

I would argue that we should reduce a time zone in the contiguous 48, not add one. As our economy grows more interconnected across the country, the time gap between the West and East Coasts becomes more problematic. And leaving the time zone of NYC and DC would be just boneheaded.

Besides, I hate staying up super late to watch sporting events and presidential debates. Instead of 9pm starts, they'd have 10pm starts so that they keep their 6pm start in California. That would be awful.

Keeping DST is the smart thing to do

By Scauma
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 9:15am

Which is why it won't happen.

Atlantic Time

By Joseph Drummond
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 10:03am

There is a one major problem in having Daylight Savings Time all year round. During January children would have to wait for the bus in the dark in the early morning hours

Isn't that still better than going home after dark, though?

By Ron Newman
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 10:51am

Kids in Grammar school get

By Joseph Drummond
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 11:58am

Kids in Grammar school get out between 2pm and 3pm

Major problem?

By Scauma
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 2:04pm

Doesn't sound very major to me. How many school days are there in January anyway? And it seems like a minor trade off for something that should otherwise have a positive impact.

In the City

By ElizaLeila
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 2:08pm

They don't wait all alone - they're in their parents' cars. All sitting with their engines running, breaking the 5 min idling law.

Start school later.

By J
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 2:32pm

Start school later.

Simple answer

By anon
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 2:36pm

For many years, people in higher latitudes have dealt with this. They put vests on the kids if they are concerned.

Otherwise, most parents wait with kids in their cars anyway.

Another simple answer: in most communities, Middle and High School would be the only affected. In those same communities, many superintendents cite stupid fake media and old people sayings to justify their ignoring and shoving aside years of research on educational outcomes done with millions of kids that says, without fail, that kids shouldn't be going to school so damn early anyway! This would be a GREAT way to force those bozos to smarten up!

Love how "experts" use science to justify giving

By roadman
Fri, 03/17/2017 - 2:08pm

the current generation of school students special entitlements like "OK, you can go to school later" when prior generations of students coped perfectly fine with getting up early for classes.

Boggles the mind to think what advancements we could have made in things that really matter (like finding cures for serious diseases) had we not focused so much attention and resources solving such a "critical' issue as justifying a way for students to become even lazier by letting them sleep in an extra hour or two.

I love how people who hate teenagers

By anon
Fri, 03/17/2017 - 3:22pm

Want to see them fail. Hate science too. And consider doing the same length of school day at a slightly different time some sort of special perk or spoiling.

Thank GOD you don't have kids! You are an immature, nasty and hatefully bitter, bitter, bitter man.

Wow those kids in other timezones ARE SO LAZY

By anon
Fri, 03/17/2017 - 3:25pm

They sleep THREE HOURS later than kids in New England. HOW LAZY!!!!

Even though they do the same amount of work, starting later is LAZY

Kids in Alaska and Hawaii are lazier still!

Same work, different time != Lazy.

You know what kid-hating TOADMAN? Hating younger people, ignoring scientific facts, spouting off hate in a reactionary way = LAZY. YOU are the one who is MENTALLY LAZY here.

Outcomes research on later start times

By SwirlyGrrl
Fri, 03/17/2017 - 6:29pm

Some of these include an improvement in an outcome near and dear to your heart, Roadman: delinquency in teens!

Recent findings:

Most studies reviewed provide evidence that delaying school start time increases weeknight sleep duration among adolescents, primarily by delaying rise times. Most of the studies saw a significant increase in sleep duration even with relatively small delays in start times of half an hour or so. Later start times also generally correspond to improved attendance, less tardiness, less falling asleep in class, better grades, and fewer motor vehicle crashes.

Source: J Sch Health. 2016 May;86(5):363-81. doi: 10.1111/josh.12388.

We found that later school start times, particularly when compared with start times more than 60 min earlier, are associated with longer weekday sleep durations, lower weekday-weekend sleep duration differences, reduced vehicular accident rates, and reduced subjective daytime sleepiness.

Source:J Clin Sleep Med. 2016 Dec 15;12(12):1681-1689. doi: 10.5664/jcsm.6358

The delay in school start time was associated with a significant (29 min) increase in sleep duration on school nights. The percentage of students receiving 8 or more hours of sleep on a school night increased to more than double, from 18% to 44%. Students in 9th and 10th grade and those with lower baseline sleep amounts were more likely to report improvements in sleep duration after the schedule change. Daytime sleepiness, depressed mood, and caffeine use were all significantly reduced after the delay in school start time. Sleep duration reverted to baseline levels when the original (earlier) school start time was reinstituted.

Source: J Dev Behav Pediatr. 2014 Jan;35(1):11-7

I could easily keep going - there's two decades of literature now! Part of why some of these are meta studies.

Oh, but as a transportation sector technician, I'm sure you know all about this already. It isn't about parroting the moral judgements that your elders abused you with - it is about health, science, and reality.

Ugh, GBH, get your facts straight

By Lynne
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 10:25am

Dear GBH, MA is not going to be "running one hour ahead of its neighbors for the six months between September and March" because DST in the US runs from the second Sunday in March to the first Sunday in November. Not March to September. Get off my lawn.

If MA stays on DST year-round, this means that:

Early March - Early November [34 weeks, ~2/3 of the year]:
MA: Noon
NYC/DC: Noon
West Coast: 9 am

Early November - Early March [18 weeks, ~1/3 of the year]
MA: Noon
NYC/DC: 11 am
West Coast: 8 am

The latest sunrise and the earliest sunset happen in December.

On standard time [current situation]: Sunrise 7:13 am, Sunset 4:11 pm
On daylight time [proposed situation]: Sunrise 8:13 am, Sunset 5:11 pm

I leave it to others to debate traffic safety, workplace timing practicalities, etc.

NY

By B
Thu, 03/16/2017 - 1:56pm

NY always sweats us! The NY Post said "Jets lose again to Patriots" regarding Hightower. Now they wanna be in our new time zone? Nahhh lol

Other New England states, maybe even New York could join our bubbling revolt against clock changing

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