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New casino rakes in $16.8 million in first week of gambling
By adamg on Mon, 07/15/2019 - 12:04pm
The Encore Boston Harbor casino made $16.8 million in gambling revenue between its opening June 23 and June 30, according to figures released today by the state Gaming Commission.
Roughly $9.1 million came from people playing slots and $7.7 million from people playing table games, according to the figures.
In contrast, the MGM Springfield casino earned about $20 million for the entire month of June, the commission says.
The Encore figures will mean $4.2 million in state tax revenue, according to the commission.
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Comments
Build the bridge
Since the Casino is here to stay, the state & Wynn should keep up the pressure to build the pedestrian bridge to Somerville adjacent to the orange line bridge. The DCR claims a study in in progress but there's no timeline.
These sorts of promises often get forgotten once facilities open. At least have someone good come from the eyesore.
Oh, they're studying alright...
except it's on how everybody gets a taste.
Everyone forgets about the Orange Line Station ped bridge
Who pays for the second required pedestrian bridge over the tracks between the existing Orange Line station and Draw Seven State Park.
My understanding is that's
My understanding is that's part of the pedestrian bridge plan.
Its isn't. Could become $35 million Bridge to Nowhere
Everett and Somerville working hand in hand on this? Unlikely.
Providence Ped Bridge Was Slated At $2 Million - Cost $22 MIL
Providence's pedestrian bridge debacle should give Encore pause. The casino's planned $32 million bridge will likely cost upward of $300 million. For a fraction of that money - the casino could have an onsite rail station and Logan Express service.
OL bridge
https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2019/06/24/encore-boston-harbor-o...
Wynn has said they'll build the bridge over they Mystic only IF the city/state builds the footbridge over the Orange Line tracks.
If I remember correctly, the Draw Seven renovations did not include the bridge over the Orange Line, but we need to apply pressure (state officials, DCR, Somerville and Everett mayors) to make sure that happens.
I really wish that Wynn's agreement had included renovations to Draw Seven and the pedestrian bridge over the OL, but given the current situation we need to convince city/state leaders to act quickly and hold the Wynn to their word to build the bridge over the Mystic.
Somerville holds the cards on that one
Beyond the state selling Draw Seven for pennies to Somerville, building new fire access roads, and having staties patrol the river bridge - I don't see Somerville complying for less. Its a rough road ahead
can you explain this?
I don't understand the dynamics you are describing.
I sort of assumed that this was all up to the state, since DCR manages Draw Seven park and MassDOT manages the orange line & train station. In that case, all Somerville could do was advocate for their preferred solution. It seems like you might have a different/better understanding of the dynamics at play.
But what was the projected revenue?
We need to remember that state and local budgets were built around projected casino revenue.
And how much of that take was "out of state" money; and how much or it from locals squandering rent and grocery money?
No. Boston's harsh winters. Everett rail station is a better opt
That ped bridge will be useless between Dec and Mar, rainy days, and very humid days. They should build the long planned Everett rail station instead
Huh?
You know there is a body of water between the Orange Line and the casino, right?
The Everett rail station would be located in, well, Everett
Right next to Encore. No need to cross a river. Do you think Everett is Somerville?
So, not a rapid transit station?
Yeah, that'll draw them.
Though to be fair, perhaps those who live along the North Shore might use it.
It will - because it fits the Casino's needs
A one seat ride to TD Garden and Cape Ann - with potential future connections to Logan
Commuter Rail to Logan?
Those are some plans I’d love to see.
The commuter rail stop
outside the casino would be nice, but it's not the primary way people will arrive, as the commuter rail frequency on the Newburyport/Rockport lines is inferior.
Even with all the delays, a 5-20 minute Orange Line wait is far less than waiting for a commuter rail trip.
"inferior"? Inferior to what
"inferior"? Inferior to what?
These days, gotta ask where we're setting the bar.
To put it in transit terms
The headway on the Newburyport/Rockport commuter rail line is inferior to that of the Orange Line.
(Although some days it seems like you wait forever for the Orange Line as well.)
If and when we finally get regional rail it would make sense to build a station outside the casino.
They have these things called "coats" and "umbrellas"...
Do you people just sit inside between December and March? You realize we've had the technology available to make it more pleasant to walk outside in less-than-perfect weather conditions for about a hundred thousand years at this point?
Not everyone is 35 and in good shape. Montreal discovered this
In Montreal, they have a similar casino setup: where the nearest subway station to their 24-hour casino is on the other side of a water bridge. It's an endless wave of medical emergencies every winter between the station and casino. In response, the casino now provides free shuttle buses from Downtown Montreal to the gaming complex.
No one's saying you have to walk
This is Boston - lots of people are plenty capable of walking a short distance with the proper gear (which they already own because lots of people already walk outside in the winter). If you're not in good enough shape for that, no one's forcing you to walk - feel free to drive, or use one of the shuttles I'm sure Encore will keep on running.
I'd also point out that Montreal has significantly worse weather than Boston in the winter, and somehow it seems that people still manage to safely walk around outside after the age of 35 and even if they're not in great shape.
And as someone else pointed out below, people walk across the Charles all year round, on what would almost certainly be a longer bridge than this one, and I haven't heard anything about mass hospitalizations.
The Montreal Casino is a good trial and error case study
Encore Boston can avoid a-lot of Montreal's mistakes. A $32 million 780 foot high-span high-slope pedestrian bridge in a winter city may not be worth it.
You won't walk outside for 5
You won't walk outside for 5 minutes in 45 degree March weather? Wow. Why do you live in Boston? Don't deny pedestrian access to other people just because you are so fragile.
The permitting process for
The permitting process for this connection has at least been started. The proponent filed an Environmental Notification Form with MEPA in April (here) and the State has completed the MEPA review (here).
They identified in the application the myriad of other permits required so don't expect any action for a while, but it has at least been initiated.
another hold-up:
Wynn has said they won't consider building the bridge unless the bridge over the OL tracks is built as well. Makes sense to do these things simultaneously, but looks like Wynn won't take the lead.
https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2019/06/24/encore-boston-harbor-o...
That sounds good, though I
That sounds good, though I still don't see how I'm supposed to be going to and from the casino with all that cash on the orange line.
You are just gonna lose the
You are just gonna lose the money to the casino. And why do you think the orange line is the Wild West where everyone is getting robbed?
Sure, um. Do you have $32 million for a seasonal bridge?
Imagine this bridge when its caked in snow and ice and there's a terrible wind chill. Imagine this bridge on an extremely hot humid day when the Mystic discharge odor is at its worst. Imagine you build this bridge and there's no funding for the rail hop over the tracks to the Orange Line. There are better options
I give you Mass Ave, betwixt Boston and Cambridge
The Mass Ave bridge is more than 500 yards long (364.4 smoots + 1 ear, natch). It spans the Charles. It's full of pedestrians December, January, February, and March. I used to be one of them.
The idea that the bridge will be unused is nonsense. We're New Englanders, not pansies from the Mid Atlantic.
Your points are valid. If it wasnt for the proposed bridge slope
Take the North Bank Ped Bridge. Multiply the slope by four.
Seriously?
Coats. Boots.
Shorts. T-shirts.
This isn't an expedition to the South Pole - it's a short walk to a climate-controlled building. People will be fine.
More than fine.
They'll be walking through the blizzard drinking an iced Dunkin.
Its a 780 foot walk with an extreme slope (non-ADA)
And that doesn't include the open space on each side. The proposed bridge is unlike anything you've used in Greater Boston.
Should we shut down the Mass
Should we shut down the Mass Pike because it gets snow on it sometimes in the winter and it costs a lot of money? Not everyone is a wimp like you and can handle walking outside.
Encore has filed with MEPA to
Encore has filed with MEPA to begin permitting of the pedestrian bridge. They've said that they plan to fully pay for it. No word on the exact timeline yet, though.
https://charlestownbridge.com/2019/05/03/encore-boston-harbor-files-for-...
Could build 2 Everett rail stops for the price of one ped bridge
Encore could build two Everett commuter rail stations for the price of one Mystic ped bridge. The recent Blue Hill station clocked in at around $16 million. When there's a big event at Encore or TD Garden, that rail station link will be critical
my understanding is the
my understanding is the everett rail stop isn't actually possible due to slope and stopping distance and the distance to the bridge and FRA regulations, although I'm sure some of the real railroad nerds around here would have more details
This is right
You cannot build a rail stop here without a ton of cat-herding. This needs to stop being presented as an option.
Extending the Silver Line 3 from Market Basket to Sullivan Square is the only realistically possible alternative.
You are 100% Wrong
Think MGH Charles. Think Grading
That is dead wrong. Example: Canton Junction
Canton Junction has a considerable slope. More so than the planned Lower Broadway (Everett) station next to the casino. You're dead wrong
This is especially important
since so many of those currently driving to the casino will soon be taking the T.
And hot weather won't be a problem
Once they lose their shirts
Build the Parking garage
Just like when the Convention Center was proposed the State said nobody will drive there. A few years after people tried to take public transportation there, everybody drives to events and ends up parking in all the satellite parking lots around Southie and Marine Industrial Park. Encore needs parking. The ferry is nice but who wants to do that in the winter.
Replicating Wynn's Skycab in Macao makes more sense
And that's not saying much. Building a gondola over the Mystic is a slightly better idea than building an 800 foot high arch bridge in Mass.
Encore Boston's trees are dying after just a few weeks
"Encore Boston planning" seems to be an oxymoron
Encore is missing its projections. No $ for a mega ped bridge
Wynn Encore Boston is turning into a dud fast. Seeking Alpha recently gave a scathing rundown of the resort's problems. Meanwhile, the Globe keeps applying a thick layer of paid BS every week. Wynn needs to partner with TD Garden and other existing entertainment-tourism entities in Boston, before its too late
Turning into a dud...lol
Casinos always open below estimate and then accelerate. New players are found, old players change their ways slowly to going to new casinos, and it takes time to pop up as a travel destination by foreign visitors compared to established casinos.
In 2-3 years, Encore Boston Harbor will overperform consistently. The area around it will have turned into an entertainment complex for multiple companies to enjoy the success, and Everett will rake in money hand over fist.
Table minimums?
Does anyone have reliable info on whether the table minimums are always $50 for all games (as I've seen on many posted reviews), or if there are lower minimums at certain times, and if so when? No info on the Encore website that I've been able to find. I enjoy betting on the occasional spin of the roulette wheel, but not that much.
$25
Was $25 the Thursday of that first week until about 9-9:30 when bumped to $50.
Definitely lower
On June 24 (second day open, Monday) most of the tables were $15/hand from around 1p-5p.
Last Wednesday Afternoon...
...saw plenty of $25 minimum tables (blackjack, roulette, baccarat) and a couple of $50s. There were even a couple of $15 tables for obscure card games I'd never heard of, but they didn't attract much attention even at that buy-in price. I dIdn't venture upstairs to the high-roller area.
Was really disappointed that -- even on a slow weekday afternoon, with plenty of tables unused -- they didn't deign to open any lower-minimum table for blackjack. They missed a golden opportunity to take my money!
The problem is the 6:5 BJ payout instead of 3:2
Except for single and double hand and who the hell wants to play those. (also 3:2 on the high roller tables I guess)
Also you are going to have too many people not knowing the rules of blackjack with $10 or $15 Min tables and I can't think of anything more annoying that sitting there and watching the guy to your left stay on 15 when the dealer has a 10 showing.
BJ
Didn't know it was 6:5 blackjack, that's beat.
You won't be complaining about him staying on 15 when on the next hand you get blackjack, will you? Or, when the Dealer flips a 4 and pulls a Queen on the next card. The cards come the way they come.
I usually leave the table if that happens more than once....
So I don't stick around long enough to see what happens. Unless the guy is some magical card counter who does that every 3rd shoe or so then fine. But the long answer is the table needs to know the rules. People who make poor gambling decisions should go to the roulette table and just watch the ball spin. (or go to the craps table and make side bets)
Or perhaps people who make poor gambling
decisions shouldn't set foot in a casino at all.
Only people who make poor gambling decisions
set foot in a casino.
Nonsense
If you go in knowing the house has the edge, that you have a limit on what you're willing to lose, and that you're looking to be lucky, then it's not a poor decision. And if you pick the right games and know the best strategies, you can give yourself a longer run and more chances to get lucky.
You shouldn't plan your retirement on winning at a casino, but you shouldn't deny the entertainment value either.
Its not supposed to be 6:5
and thats why today we have the first (of what I presume to be many) class action lawsuits against our bronze beacon of sleaze
hidden odds, rounding off dollar amounts and pocketing the change (a là Mike Judge's 1999 cult classic Office Space), I'm sure these are but a few of the many shady happenings at this world class establishment
Yea I think the casino is wrong...
The state allows 6:5 payouts, but only for the hand dealt/single deck stuff. I haven't had time to read the entire regulation, but from what I'm reading, the actual regulation on the website isn't clear either.
"Doug Williams, the head of
"Doug Williams, the head of table games for Encore Boston Harbor, says table games can be found with minimums as low as $25, a very modest price compared to the second-floor poker room where you’ll have to pony up at least $100 to get a seat."
"But here’s the bad news: you probably won’t be able to find minimums that low on the weekends. As with any casino, the minimums fluctuate depending on demand. So expect peak nights to be more expensive than, say, a weekday afternoon; late on a Friday or Saturday night, it might be difficult to find any table game with less than a $100 buy-in. The casino is also expected to be generally less busy in the summer than in the fall."
https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2019/07/12/encore-boston-harbor-c...
I contributed $4.04 of that on the first Monday
Glad to see I made such a huge difference in their bottom line.
in other observations
...saw a boat puttering around the harbor at the fish pier on Sunday afternoon with the name of "Encore Boston Harbor II" on the transom. It leads one to believe they own at least two for guests - leaning the casino toward 'Harbor' instead of Mystic River
They own three boats that
They own three boats that they run between World Trade Center in the Seaport, Long Wharf, and Encore Casino throughout the day. It's $7 per trip and anyone can use them! I rode on them to and from Long Wharf and Encore on Friday. They're very comfortable!
https://www.encorebostonharbor.com/transportation/encore-premium-harbor-...
Take them now at $7 each way
Take them now at $7 each way because that apparently is the introductory rate.
Can you keep track of the
Can you keep track of the biggest loser also?
Gross or net?
I walked away with about $350 of their money that week. I'm sure I'll give it back to them in the long run. The house always wins. But it feels good to be up on the house for now.
Poker fees?
I didn't check out the poker room closely (I did see that they let you have food and drink on little carts table-side though which is better than Mohegan and Foxwoods). Are they doing timed fees or pot rakes for their take?
Low limit is rake, higher limit is time.
Play has been slow as they have a bunch of green dealers and their systems aren’t running smoothly yet. Even chipping up at the table is a hassle.
Also it is Sometimes over 30 minutes to get chips or to cash them out.
I guess they rake in 10% (up to $5)
But also have some promo system that hasn't worked out the kinks yet among other things (new dealers, slow service for food and drink, and questions on validations for parking)
But this is all from a friend of mine who is a big poker guy and said it is one of the better poker rooms he has been in. (Also a borderline degenerate gambler!)
Amenity
Yeah, Foxwoods' room blows. I can't believe they've left it where it is for so long.
Mohegan's room is pretty but so many rules and not too large.
I liked the Encore one when I looked at it but didn't stick around to play or figure out the rules.
Lower stakes No Limit Hold
Lower stakes No Limit Hold 'Em is raked after the flop (10% of the pot up to $5)
Higher stakes (I believe it's 5/10 and higher) charges time.
I only play 1/3 and occasionally 2/5, so I'm not sure what the time charges on the higher stakes games are. Also not sure what the rake vs time breakdowns are for other games (plo, stud, limit hold em, etc.), because I only play no limit.
It's one of the nicest poker rooms I've ever played in. And I'm sure this will tail off, but they've been spreading bigger games than you can even find regularly in Vegas. They had a 50/100 no limit table running the night that I was there (along with 33 1/3 tables and 15 or 20 2/5 tables).
Tournaments coming in Sept I heard?
?
Yeah, but I've also heard
Yeah, that's what I've heard too. But I've also heard that if sports betting becomes legal in Mass they might repurpose the tournament area for a sportsbook instead and not run tournaments. Only time will tell I guess.
Blackjack
I wish they'd have some $5 tables for blackjack, instead of mostly $50.
Race book?
Encore has regular ads during the on-track feed at Saratoga, and I see they are sponsoring a handicapping contest at the track on Friday. Although these may be a thing of the past with account wagering and the NYRA app and such, does Encore have a race book?
Doesn't appear that they do
Which is why I haven't been yet. Now, they get some live money horse tournaments, I'm all in.
I'd guess
They have an area ready for a sportsbook/racebook, but I was surprised it wasn't already an active racebook. Seems like a no-brainer at this point, as sports betting will eventually be legal in Mass.
The thing with racing simulcasting is
It is tightly controlled and based on having live racing at the location. That's why there are only 3 locations that simulcast, one being a grandfathered greyhound track, one being an active harness racing track, and one being, well, where the casino should have gone but is now a newly defunct thoroughbred racing track.
Interesting
So it's the state's rule? Casinos in other states (CT, RI) have racebooks that don't have live racing. That seems like something that should change, but yes, those locations will probably protest.
DAMN. Eat your heart out
legal pot sales! Guess we know who king of the Vice Castle is! Gambling!
Think any of that tax money will "trickle down" to the T?
Encore is also being sued
Among the issues is the 6 to 5 Blackjack payout vs 3 to 2.
http://www.garicklaw.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/2019-07-15-Encore-Cl...
Is the $16.8M net or gross?
Is the $16.8M net or gross?
If it is (as I suspect) the gross, what was paid out to players in the same period?
Presumably
$16.8M less than was taken in.
Since it was described
Since it was described (incompletely) as "revenue", that wouldn't be one of the choices.
It's either
gross: $16.8M total intake minus payouts/expenses = net profit (something less than $16.8M)
or
net: unknown total intake minus payouts/expenses = $16.8M net profit
I'd settle for gross
If they gave gross take and gross payout, I'd be happy. I'm more interested in how much they profit on the gaming than how much they make after they pay their employees and cover the water bill, etc.