
Morris explains his group's ideas to make Centre Street safer.
The Boston Transportation Department has halted design work on a proposal to reduce Centre Street from the Holy Name Rotary to Spring Street in West Roxbury from four lanes to two and add pedestrian islands, bike lanes and new turn lanes so that it can study an alternative plan from a newly formed neighborhood group to keep four lanes but add pedestrian crossing lights at some intersections, re-stripe cross walks and step up police enforcement of traffic laws.
Interim BTD Commissioner Gregory Rooney told a packed meeting of the West Roxbury Safety Association at the Irish Social Club tonight the department should never have simply rolled out the proposed "road diet" plan at a June meeting without additional meetings with local residents and business owners. He said he now expects BTD to release a new proposal, or proposals, in January.
Residents who have been calling for increased enforcement are about to get a feel for that, good and hard. New E-5 Capt. Darrin Greeley, himself a West Roxbury resident, told the group he plans a traffic-safety crackdown along Centre Street - starting with all the double-parking residents and Uber Eats drivers who now infest the westbound side of Centre as they pick up food at the take-out places clustered along Manthorne Road. He said he knows only too well what happens between the Continental and Christo's from personal experience, because that was his route home from his previous job as a detective in the BPD homicide unit.
Greeley said he also plans to step up "Operation Crosswalk," in which officers will pull over drivers who blow through intersections without stopping for pedestrians there - and that he will bring in additional resources if necessary to get miscreants under control. He added, however, that, at least initially, most people will likely get warnings, rather than tickets. "We want to educate people," he said. "We don't want to fine people."
Steve Morris, who helped form the safety association, said the group agrees with proponents of the road-diet plan that the end goal is to make Centre Street safer, but that members felt the road-diet plan would only force drivers onto side streets. And citing what they said were stats from other cities, members said the plan would actually lead to increased pedestrian and bicyclist deaths, that the plan would put residents of the neighborhood's seven nursing homes at risk because it would slow first responders and that it would drive businesses out of the neighborhood. And besides, hardly anybody rides bicycles on Centre Street, they said.
Morris and other members conducted "audits" of all the intersections along Centre from the rotary to Spring Street and while he acknowledged they were not traffic engineers, he said they had something valuable - common sense. And that common sense led them to believe that the answer to greater pedestrian safety was to install pedestrian-crossing traffic signals that would only activate when a pedestrian pressed a button at certain intersections. such as at Hastings Street, where Marilyn Wentworth died in February and another pedestrian suffered a traumatic brain injury when it by a car a few years ago.
The group also called for replacement of the brick crosswalks Tom Menino was enamored of with more traditional and easier to spot striped crosswalks - something BTD crews recently have begun doing. And despite their disdain for the members of an alleged "bicycle lobby," they said they support signs along the road alerting drivers that they have to share the lane closest to the curb with bicyclists.
Although the group's founders spoke calmly and said they wanted to engage in dialog with both BTD and road-diet supporters, once they turned the room's microphones over to the audience, the anger spilled out towards bicyclists, people not from West Roxbury and the federal government, all of whom they accused of foisting the road-diet idea on West Roxbury for reasons that some said were quite sinister indeed.
The very first resident to get a mic said the city doesn't give a damn about safety and that the road diet is part of a plot to reduce Boston's carbon footprint. He accused the city of installing Blue Bikes stations along Centre Street - and even down by the Star Market on Spring Street - as part of this plot.
To applause, he said it's time to license and fine bicyclists who "cut cars off, they drive down the sidewalk and they hit people."
He was followed by the owner of a Centre Street business who said the road diet would drive her out of business. Besides, she yelled, "This isn't Amsterdam!"
Another resident said bike lanes on Washington Street in Roslindale and Beacon Street downtown have turned those roads into gridlocked hellscapes.
City Councilor Matt O'Malley (West Roxbury, Jamaica Plain), was booed when he said there are parts of the road-diet proposal he thinks are good, but that he wants to hear other proposals, too. "You're tap dancing, Matt!" one resident jumped up to yell at him. The resident then accused O'Malley of acting like a socialist whenever he's in the Jamaica Plain end of the district.
Nobody mentioned that the road-diet idea sprang from a study by a civil-engineering team at Northeastern University about Centre Street two years ago - which started when a graduate student from West Roxbury complained to her professor about Centre Street safety - and which basically gathered dust on a shelf somewhere until a February meeting at the Elks Club at which Wentworth's husband and son pleaded for the city to do something so that nobody would ever again have to go through what they did.
A Roslindale resident, who first joked he wasn't sure if he would make it out of the room alive, was, in fact, booed into sitting down when he explained how he thought the road diet would improve safety by forcing motorists to slow down and how the ultimate answer was to get more people onto public transit.
A West Roxbury resident essentially told bicyclists they can just shut up until they start paying taxes for roads. After asking car owners to raise their hands, he said, "These are our roads!"
One West Roxbury resident did rise to support the road-diet proposal, saying he owns both a car and a bicycle and that he and his wife both "drive all over the place." He said his top concern are crashes in which one driver stops for a pedestrian and a second one then plows into the person.
He tried to rebuke the notion of some "Bicycle Lobby" sinisterly pulling strings to destroy West Roxbury.
"We're people just advocating for safety," he said. "I"m a dad, a brother, a husband and a son, I'm not just a [bicyclist]."
Morris, who had earlier called the road diet "a stupid idea," said his group's plans would reduce such crashes through better sight lines - in part by having police deal with the issue of double parkers. And he said he and other founders felt "bushwacked" at the July meeting, when he said it seemed like outside bicyclists and other non-local agitators had had a series of secret meetings to prepare.
One mother of two young children, who live up at Lagrange and Keith streets, said she wasn't even sure what the fuss was about - she walks up and down Centre with her kids in a double-wide stroller and finds it "extremely safe." But if people don't agree, "why can't we put it on a ballot?" she asked.
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Comments
Yep and enforcement where badly needed will be skipped still
By Parkwayne
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 8:55am
Like Forest Hills.
Traffic enforcement at Forrest Hills would improve quality of life for all manner of commuters - bus, bike, pedestrian, car. Yet because some WR dipshits are throwing a tantrum, we'll get enforcement outside of Tres Amigos for a month and that's it. I'll never understand why the BPD and City don't think it's worth trying to enforce basic laws while still dropping everything to protect Nazis like they are the fucking pope or something.
Yep
By Bobp
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 9:04am
Or hyde park ave or washington street.
Terrible West Roxbury People
By Ann Onymous
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 2:38pm
A month ago when the story was about teardowns we were yuppie's who building "McMansions". Now we're crusty old white people who will never change. Can you people make up your mind?
Drivers in West Roxbury want increased safety too, but nothing was being done before to enforce laws for cars, bikes, or pedestrians. By all means, ticket speeders, distracted drivers, double parkers, and Especially anyone who runs through a crosswalk. But can we also cut down on jaywalking, bikers who want to be cars when there's a green light and pedestrians when there's a walk signal, and businesses that have delivery trucks blocking a full lane on Centre Street? Putting up flashing lights at crosswalks would be extremely helpful. It would also be nice to get some of those bike signals like they have in Cambridge, so drivers can be aware when taking a right turn that bikes may be coming. Speed humps could also help. Has anyone studied what reducing to a single lane would do to traffic?
Please clarify
By perruptor
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 6:12am
Don't you think bikes have the same rights as cars when there;s a green light, that pedestrians have the right of way at a walk light, or are you saying something else? I don't understand why you'd want to "cut down" on those things.
There was a whole study done
By anon
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 8:09am
There was a whole study done a few years ago by actual people that know about this stuff...which is why the road diet was proposed.
Love reading
By anon
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 8:29am
All the comments from people outside of Westie.
Yup we’re all racist, criminals for not wanting this crap.
Enjoy your day you miserable MF.
I live in Westie
By Miss M
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 11:36pm
I've owned a house here for a decade. I send my kid to school here. I shop local businesses. And I think everyone involved in the anti-road diet jihad is an absolute loon.
And then, at 8:15 the next morning...
By commutes to westie
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 8:40am
Two double-parkers on the first few blocks of Centre: one car double-parked, just behind an empty space, with his driver's door open into traffic; a delivery truck with the lights flashing.
And another delivery truck, parked with his right wheels up on the sidewalk at the "top" of a t-intersection.
That's in the blocks between Corey and Mt. Vernon during the commute immediately following the announcement of the delay on the road diet.
BTD can't get E-5 to do enforcement for at least twenty-four hours, nevermind for the additional months or years it will take to come up with a fallback plan.
Trump-esque
By Jim C
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 8:49am
It's good to see this group lay it bare that they are a bunch of Trump-esque culture warriors that hate anything they perceive to be liberalism. Hence the obsessive focus on bicycles when bikes are a secondary part of this at most. I don't expect anything less from people like this in truth. I do expect more from our supposedly progressive elected officials like Marty Walsh who should not in any way listen to these people who will never vote for him anyway.
It's been depressing
By Miss M
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 8:52am
to realize that my neighborhood is full of people who hear "safer traffic pattern" and somehow translate it into "vast socialist conspiracy coming to destroy my way of life."
Just a bunch of white folks
By Parkwayne
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 10:08am
Whose main take away from the Kavanaugh hearings is that if you're a white middle aged guy, you can angrily demand that no-one do anything you don't like.
Fuck West Roxbury. I'm going to have to try to figure out which businesses were against this so I can avoid going to them.
Sadly...
By Gary C
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 10:04am
It's basically all of them.
To be fair
By Miss M
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 12:57pm
I am 100% certain all of them were angrily demanding that no one do anything they don't like WELL before the Kavanaugh hearings. He certainly didn't invent the Aggrieved White Man strategy.
Parkwhine...Seek help pronto
By Roztonian
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 1:18pm
So in your mind, being anti-road diet is equal to being Pro Kavanaugh....and inherently evil if white. You seem like an open-minded, fair person.
uh, oh, I'm sure the businesses on Centre Street are super concerned that Parkwhine will be putting them on blast with his cancel culture outlook and super-woke boycott.
You should seek help for your anger, racism, and bigoted worldview.
Good luck fella!
I know!
By Anon
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 12:17pm
This comment, "The very first resident to get a mic said the city doesn't give a damn about safety and that the road diet is part of a plot to reduce Boston's carbon footprint." really got to me. I'm realizing more & more how twisted some of my neighbors' logic is. They are against reducing Boston's carbon footprint too? Yikes.
I still don't know if I would be 100% in favor of the "road diet," but this type of nonsense makes me want to go support it.
LOL
By Scratchie
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 9:07am
In other words, the plan is to do what should have been done from the start, in every neighborhood in every city of the Commonwealth.
Good luck with that. If Massholes actually wanted crossing lights, striped crosswalks and police enforcement of traffic laws, they would have had them for the last fifty years.
put another way
By SC from JP
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 12:05pm
They'll just try out what we've got on Centre between Weld St and Murray Circle, because that's such a famously safe area to cross the street.
"hardly anybody rides
By Make Boston Bus...
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 9:10am
"hardly anybody rides bicycles on Centre Street, they said."
I know I don't because I don't want to die. West Roxbury is a raceway with no enforcement. So my only choice to get to the gym is to drive. It's ridiculous how the car jerks make our lives both more dangerous and less healthy while making sure there is no way to curb carbon emissions and pollution.
And the city is knuckling under because of the screamers.
Cosigned 100%
By ZachAndTired
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 2:17pm
I would love to ride my bike to the Y or Roche Brothers or to grab some dinner, but I don't feel safe doing it. So it sits in my garage. The people arguing that we don't need bike lanes, because nobody rides their bikes in Westie need to unpack that a little bit and figure out why people don't ride their bikes. My guess is we aren't the only two people who feel this way. "If you build it, [they] will come."
Meek Marty
By NorthEnd3r
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 9:19am
Even someone dying is not enough for Meek Marty to reject toxic car culture. Safety should not be subject to the whims of the angry few who attend public meetings.
toxic car culture...just wow.
By Roztonian
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 1:37pm
This may be the funniest comment/terms in the entire thread.
No, yours is
By perruptor
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 6:24am
You think cars stopped being toxic when they stopped adding lead to the fuel? They didn't. And beyond a strictly chemical definition of toxic, the entire reason for this discussion is that the car culture beloved by the "Safety Committee" is literally killing people.
Good grief
By fungwah
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 9:21am
And did you ask for pedestrians to raise their hands? What roads do they get?
Those flashing yellow lights
By The Boston Crab
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 9:22am
Those flashing yellow lights look real pretty as cars fly through them on Cambridge St in Allston. If it's a straightaway, most drivers will only stop at a stop sign, red light, or actual physical impediment, regardless of right of way.
I think the stores will regret this
By Gary C
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 10:08am
The stores need customers and most of them arrive by car, thus parking is key. I get that. The anti-diet folks got all worked up about how the road diet would drive businesses out of the neighborhood. Every one of those double-parkers were running in to do business in one of the stores. Now (well for a couple weeks anyway) the cops will be making it tough to double park and it will discourage people from coming to those Centre Street businesses. Nice job!
If I can't double park so I don't have to walk ...
By anon
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 10:35am
I'll go to a mall with a big parking lot so I can walk fifteen times as far as I would have if I found a space!
You can't take mah freeeedumb!
Evidence?
By NorthEnd3r
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 10:47am
"Most of them arrive by car" is a common, unverified refrain.
This is an interesting question I think
By Parkwayne
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 12:10pm
specifically in WR, the shopping 'district' is fairly stretched out with a few zones. So from say Porter Cafe by Holy Name down to the Irish Social Club I'd guess is a 10-15 minute walk. That's much different than JP or Roslindale where the stores and restaurants are more densely clustered. On top of that, as there are fewer apts overall and near Centre St, the number of people living in walking distance to those stores is also a bit lower than Rosi or JP (IMO, feel free to show me contrary data).
Anecdotally when I want something from Himalaya or Recaro for example, I'm driving up there. If it was either taking the bus (probably 40 minutes round trip accounting for waiting, stops, etc...) or riding my bike or not going, honestly, I'm not going. I'll just opt to go to a place in the square. I don't think that mindset is an outlier. Now if you want to make the case that I shouldn't be driving up there and should only be walking into the square, I get it! Honestly, I probably should. However, most of us are probably guilty of sometimes doing the thing which is convenient and appealing vs. toeing a hardline of virtuous living.
Team road diet, but I think it's simply not true that WR businesses could survive on foot traffic.
Here's another one to consider - Roslindale is very walkable and that's awesome but you're fooling yourself if you think the thriving restaurants aren't also dependent on folks driving here from places like Brookline, Dedham, WR, JP, etc...
Edit: to sum up, I think a place like WR needs to be viewed as more multi-modal in terms of transit for now (say 10-20 years) until there's more density and an Orange Line on the Needham tracks. Until then, cars are part of the mix, along with bikes, buses, walking, etc... and to ignore that is idealistic but unhelpful.
Here's the thing: No one is
By cden4
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 12:21pm
Here's the thing: No one is saying that anyone needs to change how they currently get to the businesses on Centre St. The people who drive can still continue to drive. A few parking spaces are being eliminated, but overall there is still PLENTY of parking available. However, a road diet will allow people to safely walk and bike to the businesses should they choose to do so. But even if not a single person switches from driving, the road diet will still work as planned. The street will be safer for everyone, and everyone can still get where they need to go.
Yes, I know
By Parkwayne
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 12:37pm
I was responding the comment questioning whether or not most of the WR business district customers drive or walk. I think it's more car than walk for a variety of reasons.
Couldn't have been clearer that I'm in favor of the road diet but hey, you got your talking points out so good on you.
I was mainly replying to your
By cden4
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 1:36pm
I was mainly replying to your comment "Team road diet, but I think it's simply not true that WR businesses could survive on foot traffic." No one is claiming that the businesses need to or should survive on foot traffic.
North3nder?
By Parkwayne
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 3:00pm
""Most of them arrive by car" is a common, unverified refrain."
I read that as someone questioning if cars were really the dominant way for shoppers to get to WR stores and restaurants and I'd say they pretty much are.
I'd Say...
By NorthEnd3r
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 4:45pm
...You might be surprised. Collect some data before repeating an off-said, rarely verified claim.
Evidence was everyone against
By anon
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 2:33pm
Evidence was everyone against the diet bitching that they don’t be able to park to do an errand. And business owners saying the same.
I think they should change The length of Centre to be paid meters. Those damn bikers want everything for free!! Not us car owners tho!!
In many other places where shopping streets ...
By Lee
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 11:05am
... were made more pedestrian friendly, sales actually went up.
Just like when they banned smoking in restaurants in MA. Some owners objected saying they would lose income. Yet after the ban restaurants showed a 15% increase in customers.
Change is the real threat.
By MakeBostonBusesFree
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 2:12pm
Change is the real threat.
West Roxbury where the deep
By anon
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 10:08am
West Roxbury where the deep ignorance never changes. The fact that the city caved (yet again) to the loud, uniformed mouths of West Roxbury is pathetic.
The fact that these asshats yelling "these are our roads" is pretty sad when they think car owners are the only ones to pay taxes. Obviously they have conveniently forgotten their measly excise tax pays for nothing. Time to raise the gas tax!
To the women yelling "this isn't' Amsterdam" she should do some research of why Amsterdam/Netherlands works and why it happened. She should also see the booming businesses on every corner in every neighborhood. The stupidity, short-shortsightedness, and "me, me, me" attitude of WR has always made me sick. And seeing the BS put out by the people against any change for safety makes me more so.
Considering they don't do anything now we all know BTD and the cops aren't going to to anything about this after a few weeks. To add insult to injury they won't ticket people? So basically they are saying "drivers, continue to be dicks - we actually encourage it."
Does anyone have a list of the businesses that supposedly didn't support the road-diet? It seems like it was a "many people have said" moment without anyone having the nuts to post anything in their stores.
Businesses
By RalphM
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 5:49am
Business owners on record against the road diet in the local newspaper or other media:
- Atlas True Value
- City Lock
- Gormley Funeral Home
- Hennigan Insurance
- LAER Realty
I’m sure there are others opposed as the main opposition group claims but they haven’t published the names as far as I know. They should do so.
So you're basically trying to
By Jim Curley
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 9:58am
So you're basically trying to dox them? What a coward.
Pssst -- they've already publicly made statements on this
By fungwah
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 2:45pm
It's not doxxing if someone reports on a public statement someone else makes. Unless you think the Globe is "doxxing" Mayor Walsh every time they mention something he said in a press release.
RalphM isn't the Globe and
By Jim Curley
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 5:48pm
RalphM isn't the Globe and these business owners aren't the Mayor. No one thinks for a second that the intent of naming them here isn't to cause harm.
Not much of a doxxing
By Jim C
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 3:14pm
Not much of a doxxing considering some of these business people have gone on Dan Rea's WBZ Radio show about this and been very public on Facebook. They've also have been quoted in the Bulletin and Herald. If they want to oppose it more power to them but they shouldn't expect zero consequences.
This is good info
By Angry Dan
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 12:33pm
These local businesses apparently don't feel that they need any of their local customers who are on foot or bike in their immediate neighborhood. We should help them prove their point by taking our business elsewhere.
In a lot of cases, the only advantage of a local business over more distant competitors is the convenience of not having to drive and park. Driving straight to Home Depot makes more sense than parking in front of True Value only to find out they don't have what you need.
Didn't somebody literally
By ZachAndTired
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 2:22pm
Didn't somebody literally just crash into Hennigan Insurance last week? I wonder if that made them reconsider their position.
Were they ...
By perruptor
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 3:46pm
on a bike, or walking? If they were, I doubt it had much of an impact on the insurance man's thinking.
Big four wheeled motorized
By ZachAndTired
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 4:28pm
Big four wheeled motorized bike with a roof and doors.
https://www.universalhub.com/2019/van-driver-smashes-light-pole-west-roxbury
The level of
By anon
Wed, 11/20/2019 - 10:54am
Unhinged lunacy in this thread is shocking. People are racist because they oppose outside pressure to change the neighborhood they live in.
Trump - Check
Brett Kavanaugh - Check
Racism - Check
Murderers - Check
Im ecstatic my neighbors stood up for THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD, and tickled to read these bizarre comments.
The three cyclist from Westie must be devastated.
It’s not just YOUR
By anon
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 8:25am
It’s not just YOUR neighborhood bc you’re the loudest and spread falsities like wildfire. It’s everyone’s neighborhood. We live there and spend money there too.
Says "anon," originally from
By Jim Curley
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 1:47pm
Says "anon," originally from upstate New York, moved here after grad school (but didn't finish!), bought an overpriced condo in a triple-decker in Roslindale, brags constantly how "diverse" her neighborhood is, hangs out mostly with people who think just like him/her, has been planning on moving to Vermont, just trying to work out the details.
Well, "Jim Curley," I came to
By Miss M
Thu, 11/21/2019 - 3:51pm
Well, "Jim Curley," I came to Boston 25 years ago for college, have lived in the city since, have owned a home in West Roxbury for a decade, work in Dedham, and don't really plan on ever leaving, so I guess your miserable ass is just going to have to get used to at least some members of the neighborhood actually wanting to change things occasionally!
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