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Gaza protesters shut BU Bridge
By adamg on Thu, 11/16/2023 - 9:22am
Protesters block bridge in Cambridge. Photo via Cambridge PD.
Protesters with signs calling for an end to the Israeli invasion following the Hamas massacre of Israelis blocked both sides of the BU Bridge this morning.
Cambridge Police alerted motorists to "please find an alternate route to avoid delays."
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Were there no more posters of
Were there no more posters of kidnapped babies to tear down?
Since the Protesters are American Jews,
from the organization IfNotNow, it is highly unlikely that they go around tearing down posters of Israeli hostages. Chapters nationwide have been staging protests calling for immediate ceasefire in Gaza.
https://www.ifnotnowmovement.org/
From an IfNotNow statement posted in October:
Our pain is not your weapon. Our grief is not your excuse. Stop using Jewish pain to justify Israeli massacres of Palestinians. War crimes do not justify more war crimes. Revenge is not a strategy for safety for anyone.
Just saying
There was a ceasefire in effect on October 6th.
You keep saying that word
I do not think it means what you think it means.
Just saying
Israel has killed over 100 UN aid workers in Gaza since the incursion started.
And something like 11,000
And something like 11,000 Palestinians, most of whom are women and children.
It is perfectly possible to deplore both sides.
Yeah, but...
We've all agreed that Israel is allowed to kill all the Palestinians necessary to get to the hidden Hamas among them. I just hadn't seen anyone declare the right ratio of aid workers to Israelis they were allowed to kill in any of the "they haven't violated the rules of war" proportionality arguments yet.
So, 12:1 doesn't tip Adam's scale for bringing up the Israelis in his news items regarding people protesting Israel's chosen methods of
revengedefense yet. I just wonder how many more UN workers attempting to aid humanity that Israel is allowed to kill before enough is enough.NB - An earlier version of this article called out specifically "1,200 Israelis" in it.
I just wonder how many more
The Geneva Conventions specify that unarmed, identified medical personnel may not be targeted. If a military commander knows that a medic is in a trench with a bunch of combatant soldiers, it is still perfectly within the laws of war to shell that trench, even though doing so puts the medics at risk.
Aid workers who choose to work in these conditions are heroic because they choose to put themselves in harm's way. If Israel's warmaking is legitimate, then these aid workers are a tragic but legal casualty. If Israel's warmaking is illegitimate, then everything which results from that is as well.
It is inevitable that even the most just of warmaking (e.g. Ukraine defending itself) will result in the deaths of large numbers of innocents. That is an excellent reason to do all we can to avoid starting wars and stop them as quickly as practical.
My view is that Hamas declared unrestricted war on Israel, and in doing so, made itself a legitimate target of war. As such, the blame for these innocents' deaths lies first with Hamas for their dramatic and barbaric escalation of hostilities. Palestinians are going about their lives normally in Ramallah because while the fundamental disagreement between the West Bank and Israel and Gaza and Israel are the same, the PA has favored negotiation over arms.
The 11,000 figure includes Hamas terrorists.
The Hamas terrorists will not tell you that, though, because this whole tragedy is a brilliantly planned, incomprehensibly evil exercise in public relations, designed to capitalize on the worldwide increase in antisemitism stoked by Tr*mp, Le Pen, Orban, et. al.
If This is a Hamas PR Operation...
then the Israeli government is stupidly playing directly into the hands of Hamas. My suggestion would be...maybe don't do exactly what your sworn enemies want you to do?
What would you have Israel do right now?
I'm not talking about a long-term solution, I'm talking about removing the immediate threat --Hamas -- once and for all.
What?
That IS a long-term solution.
The immediate issue is returning the hostages and dealing with immediate threats.
You're right, it will take a long time to root out Hamas.
And even longer to bring lasting peace to the region. Personally, I hope for the kind of two-state solution the UN approved and Israel accepted in 1948. Worth remembering that the Arab powers declared war on Israel rather than accept the UN solution, and lost.
In the meantime, all the civilian casualties should be blamed on Hamas, who continue to use their people as human shields. Innocent Palestinians should be doing everything they can to HELP Israel rid Gaza of the scourge of Hamas.
Exactly!
That way we can get back to letting Israel kill them slowly in smaller numbers over longer periods of time under excruciating conditions where we won't notice the oppression as much...I mean at least it'd stop all the bridge blocking.
Do you think Hamas is good for Gaza?
Do you stand with Palestinians who support Hamas?
Get off it
That's a really tired argument.
Human rights abuses are human rights abuses.
"once and for all" = your final solution?
WTF
This, quite simply, is the logic of a sociopath. "Look, you made me blow up a hospital, Hamas. It's all your fault."
Are you really seeing Hamas as the victim here?
That's just astonishing to me.
If Hamas put down their weapons and surrendered, it would end the war and the killing of innocents.
If Israel put down their weapons and surrendered, it would end Israel.
Thick headed nonsense
I can’t tell if you’re dishonest or stupid, but at this point, it doesn’t matter. No one’s calling Hamas the victim.
You actually stumbled into the truth...
"Look, you made me blow up a hospital, Hamas. It's all your fault."
...yet you label it sociopathic logic. It IS all Hamas's fault. Israel has no choice.
But you seem to be more fond of invective (thickheaded, sociopathic, stupid, dishonest) than debate, so I'm done engaging with you, Pete. Life is too short.
False choices
Horseshit. Israel has a number of choices. The powers that be only like one of them.
Absolute sociopathy
All genocides start with such "logic".
Shame on you.
What would you have Israel do
Rebranding the operation is apparently an option in some peoples' eyes:
On the ground inside Gaza, where Israel is trying to save civilians from Hamas
https://nypost.com/2023/11/15/opinion/on-the-ground-inside-gaza-where-is...
Well, it might not be rebranding. Maybe he was only talking about saving Israeli civilians.
Seriously, though... I'd suggest - partition parts of Gaza to prevent any movement of large-scale forces, surround/isolate/take control of crucial infrastructure & assets (with some restraint on the "bomb them into dust first" approach), take control of crucial infrastructure like the hospitals & guard/escort fuel and relief supply convoys so that Hamas doesn't skim most of it off for themselves, and....
Those tunnel entry shafts that are so important because (a) they were a crucial part of the path of Hamas' attach and (b) they're the justification for beating up on a hospital?
Howzabout IDF taking their forces & weapons & tech (like bomb squad robots, maybe?) and identify all of the tunnels & access points on the Israeli side of the line, disarm or blow up the booby traps, and follow the tunnels back to the source!!!
If it wasn't for the likelihood of hostages being held there, I'd Just say "flood them"
On my ride into work
From a distance it looked like the protest and police presence had expanded to Storrow. But No, it was just a stupid overheight truck.
Much like Middle East wars, some things will never change.
Cease Storrowing Now!!
Cease Storrowing Now!!
FREE LEASED RYDER TRUCKS!
From The Riverbank To The University!
Boston's solution to everything
Erect a series of low-clearance bridges between Israel and Gaza. Problem solved.
The best advisory is no
The best advisory is no advisory. The BPD
Cambridge
Not everything fits your anti-Wu narrative.
Buy a map, troll.
n/t
Please note these are Jewish
Please note these are Jewish protesters demanding a ceasefire, the release of the israeli hostages, and the end of apartheid. They are refuting that the safety of Israelis and the safety of Palestinians are at odds.
I’m disappointed in this journalism. The language neglects to mention the 11,000 civilian deaths, which is part of what brought them out to protest. The language used has implications that do not represent what these protesters are calling for.
Whoopie
There will always be a minority within a minority that people can point to and say "see?"
The majority of (but certainly not all) Jews stand for: the release of hostages, support of Israel's right to self defense and against antisemitism; like to 290,000K+ who peacefully protested at the National Mall this Tues.
So good try trying to gaslight by focusing on a fringe group within the Jewish community. Next!
No True Scotsman…Eh?
Most people (including Jews) are able to hold complicated views on the Palestine-Israel conflict.
What you dismiss as “a fringe” is far from it, it is the majority of Jews outside of Israel that are deeply upset by the violence committed against Israel and against Palestinian civilians.
The lunatic fringe are those who believe only lives lost on one side matter.
So effective!
I hear Israel heard about this protest and immediately stopped.
Seriously, what good does this do? I am certain they didn't win any commuters over to their cause.
Four Congressional Districts
Are within a mile of this site.
Four districts which are hearing from their voters. Four districts which had traffic messed up because of this.
There's four people (well maybe three who would actually do it) who can help with a ceasefire call.
That's a start.
Yes, but generally speaking
Yes, but generally speaking pissing people off by fucking up their commute doesn't really endear them to you. Like throwing soup on a painting, at some point the normal everyday people you're trying to get to call their senators are going to look at your protest activities and be like "what the fuck".
These kind of demonstrations are only useful when there is no ongoing attention or narrative to a problem. They were arguably useful during the BLM summer, because the news, social media, etc, was not talking about the issue and certainly in no national context. Forcing people to stop their everyday activities will bring your cause to their attention, if nothing else.
However it's not useful for issues where everybody is aware of it and it's an ongoing discussion and your goal as a protester is to convince people (voters) to take specific action (congressional pressure).
They are protesting to
They are protesting to demonstrate strong emotion together, and perhaps to increase awareness of what they feel strongly about. Protest is not about convincing useless bystanders (e.g. Universal Hub readers) of anything.
Americans in 2023 sit in the stands and insist on being entertained/convinced.
The cry and hew about Gaza by
The cry and hew about Gaza by thousands but not a peep from the same about the efforts the Ugandan government to kill Gay people. Or Arab states that use laws to remove body parts as punishment.
The idea that Israel is some terrible nation that oppresses other people is full of bull when compared to the horrors of Arab states against their own population. Is it because Israel is seen as easier to protest while Arab states are seen as untouchable?
While the object of the protest has a substantive issue at its core this still reminds me of the folks looking for a reason to express anger and rage because they believe they are otherwise not heard. Such as the stupid people who were up in arms about what they call cultural appropriation. Stupid.
What is obvious but is ignored is that Palestinians are the cannon fodder of nations that want Israel to disappear. The governments of Arab nations and Iran realize they will never be able to make Israel disappear as a nation. The US will never permit that to happen.
So maintain constant threats against Israelis. Not just Israel but Israelis. All Israelis. There is a mental sickness that infects Arab rulers, kings, sultans and whatnot where they use the hatred of Jews to maintain their own positions. There is evil in the Middle East. It is not found in Israel (even with Netanyahu who could almost pass for an Israeli version of Donald Trump).
I don't want Israel to
I don't want Israel to disappear. I don't know anyone who does.
I do want Israel to stop freely electing leaders who kill children in Gaza for their own political gain.
If you better understand what people actually believe it's much more difficult to dehumanize then kill them.
Again with this?
"But they throw gay men off buildings in Chechnya!" is the cry of a Red Hat who hates gays, he just hates Muslims more.