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After Nazis flee and protesters mostly disperse, troublemakers, well, cause trouble
By adamg on Sat, 08/19/2017 - 5:38pm
Shortly before 3:50 p.m, Boston Police reported:
BPD confirming rocks being thrown at officers on Tremont at West.
Shortly after 5 p.m., Karen Zgoda reported police were using pepper spray in Downtown Crossing:
Mace being deployed avoid Downtown Crossing bring milk for your eyes cc @universalhub pic.twitter.com/hRykbjO0Su
— KarenZgoda (@karenzgoda) August 19, 2017
Boston Police report a total of 33 arrests for the day.
Scene at Downtown Crossing about 20 min ago. Circumstances unclear. Let's all stay classy and peaceful. @universalhub @bostonpolice #Boston pic.twitter.com/gZ6NnULo2B
— Joshua Fabian (@JFabi) August 19, 2017
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Comments
Thank You, UHUB
Thank you for doing the best, clearest, most sane reporting on all ish today. I appreciate you.
Good reporting?
It is inaccurate to call the protesting group nazis. They aren't. The explicitly said any one that goes and says anything about white power, naziism, kkk, or is known to be a white supremacist will be ejected. They denounced racism, naziism, skin heads and white supremacists publicly many times.
They are for liberty, free speech, personal freedom,
economic freedom and
for allowing the voice of conservatives, centrists, and libertarians to be heard on college campuses and society.
So, the reporting by this site sucks
Show us
Where did they say those things? If it was on the Web, you can link to the place they said it very easily. There's a convenient button on the commenting page that lets you embed a link in your comment. Do that, and maybe we'll believe you.
If you think the reporting here sucks, why do you come here? For the waffles?
Black Lives Matter Makes Me Boston Proud
Kudos to the awesome women who organized the march from Roxbury to Boston Common. They are the women of Boston Black Lives Matter. And thanks to the 15,000 people who marched to say to Boston and the US, we are not willing to concede that there's a place in the Republican party for neo-Nazis, Neo-Confederates and white supremacists.
The media coverage will focus on the controversies but it should be about the march and how in addition to the march, another 15,000 showed on the Common in opposition, and how how so-called Free Speech advocates stayed away.
Heresy!
Waffles?!? French Toast 4 evah!!!
Google "FreeSpeechBoston" and
Google "FreeSpeechBoston" and you'll see their Facebook page.
spearker list does not support those claims.
They did claim on their FB page that they would kick out white supremacists. And yet, here is their original speaker list, full of those types.
https://cbsboston.files.wordpress.com/2017/08/free-speech-rally-poster.j...
forgot to add...
I mean, they invited Kyle Chapman, whose sole claim to fame is beating anti trump protesters with a stick.
Right, their aim was not to
Right, their aim was not to keep out white supremacIST people but to keep out white supremacY speech.
The difference is not applying a label to people and automatically blacklisting them.
Troublemakers?!
That's all they are?! No association with any fringe groups on the left whatsoever?! You love to use the term "Nazis" to describe everybody on the right. The people on the left are "troublemakers"? Okay Adam...
Perhaps you can tell us
which leftist group they're associated with? You know, just point us to a link to the group claiming responsibility, or to a solid bit of evidence connecting the (as yet unnamed) antagonists with one of the groups you've decided is morally equivalent to the Nazis?
No? You don't have a name, or evidence? Then maybe you should consider shutting the fuck up with this "But BLM!" bullshit.
I'm not the reporter here...
I'll leave it up to Adam to deduce.
Massive Fallacy
I can claim whatever I want completely without facts and YOU HAVE TO INVESTIGATE IT FOR ME!
This really bugs you doesn't it? Maybe you should be arguing with yourself rather than shitposting vacuous contradiction and little temper tantrums here? You wouldn't last 5 minutes in the real military.
I lasted 8 years in the military...
Thank you very much.
So?
"Thank you for your service", but your arguments are weak and flabby.
If that's what they chant
If that's what they chant repeatedly, that's who I associate them with.
Antifa and BLM.
Antifa and BLM.
How can you equate antifa and
How can you equate antifa and black lives matter with Nazis?
Joe
You're going to be disappointed when you find out these fools didn't vote in the last election, or any election.
Oh, who am I kidding. You'll probably say they're Clinton staffers.
27 arrests today. All 27
27 arrests today. All 27 arrests were "counter protesters".
Nope
You left out the guy in a MAGA hat with a gun.
Ok, 26 and 1. Thanks for the
Ok, 26 and 1. Thanks for the clarification.
I'm with the progressives
Whoever is doing these bits of violence at demonstrations needs to be arrested and prosecuted, and get whatever pscyhological/psychiatric help they apparently need.
If they identify as "left", then they are the enemy of left ideals, and are the unwitting friend of the right wing extremists.
If they are false-flagging, shame on them, and the counterterrorism people can probably figure that out.
Yep, despite what has been
Yep, despite what has been widely reported here, it was was the left that was the problem.
I try to be neutral; but, it's kinda hard when the supposed voice of reason ends up being this...
What happened?
33 people out of 22,000-24
33 people out of 22,000-24,000 is a "problem"? The North End on a weekend is rowdier than that.
More arrests in the North End
Something like 25 people?
Closer to 45
If you include both Friday and Saturday.
1 person out of 3 dozen, as
1 person out of 3 dozen, as compared to 26 out of 22,000. I guess crowd size matters.
Uhm, that's because your boys were quickly escorted out of town
-for their own safety. I agree with this strategy by BPD to keep the peace, but don't crow about how none of your guys were arrested while they ran for their lives.
Counter protestors....
Have left the common for their lily white suburbs & neighborhoods.
Half of them marched from the Reggie Lewis Center this am
Don't know why you thought that was a valid complaint anyway.
Proof?
Or is that another "well, I'm not the reporter here".
By that logic, I can say that most of the Nazis came from Hanscom Field and you have to prove that wrong.
Huh?
There were two large counter-protests. Half* of us just went to the Common and stayed there, the other half went to Reggie Lewis Center and marched in.
* OK, maybe it was 60/40, but both groups were huge.
Ok
I said this earlier to people while at the rally...
I've been to alot of rally's this year as many of you know (by my photographs I take). But this one.. for some reason, I had an uneasy feeling about. I actually felt "unsafe".
There were people there in what I call "personal riot gear".. which is boots, hoodies, bandannas over faces, goggles.. they looked like they were ready for anything. Of course, after what happened last weekend, I can see why
But there were people there who just looked and acted like they were waiting to start something.. like they wanted violence to happen so they could act.
I just could not shake the feeling. After the "free speech" people were escorted out.. I left. I figured it would disperse after that. Apparently it did not..
Sad that hours after a really peaceful march, a few bad apples make the rest of us look bad.
A few bad apples?!
Come on... Lots of bad apples and they're on the left.
Um yeah
27 people were arrested out of the estimated 30k that attended.
So let's do some quick math... that means that .09% of attendees caused trouble.
Less than 1%.. less than a fraction of 1%.. so yeah a few bad apples.
So arrests equal bad apples?
Spare me.
Have a delightful day
Have a delightful day fine sir... you are trying to bait me.
Nice try.
27?
I would love to compare this number to the arrests / protective custody number coming out of the Buffett concert tonight.
Something tells me that the Mansfield police may go for the win tonight.
Nice job BPD today.
Yeah 27
I'm going by what my newsies (WBZ, if you care) tell me. 27 people were arrested today.
I agree. I wonder how many people will be arrested at the Buffet concert for public drunkenness.
I saw a fair number of the arrests
Some friends and I happened to wander past the boylston street exit right as the Nazis were being escorted out in police vehicles, so I was on the front lines for what happened next. The crowd was pretty densely packed in between the fence around the Common and the buildings on the other side of the street, so when the riot police showed up and formed a wedge to drive the crowd back, there wasn't much space for us to go anywhere. I got a baton shoved in my face by an unsmiling man in full body armor. One of the people arrested was the guy on my immediate right, who I can't honestly tell if he fell down or went limp in front of the wedge. If they try to make charges against him stick, they're going to have a hell of a hard time convincing a jury. Dude didn't throw hands or in any way attack the police, he just didn't clear the way fast enough for them. It was a little chaotic, but the same appeared to be true for the other half dozen arrests near me.
Meanwhile, antifa was literally on the roof tops behind us, and...did nothing. Just kept the cameras rolling. There were some harsh words spoken, but the guys with bandanas over their faces weren't the ones being arrested, and weren't doing anything to antagonize the police. Since it was so obvious that the Nazis were fleeing with their tails between their legs, there wasn't really anything for antifa to do.
This is not accurate. The exchange was broadcast on Channel 7.
There was an entire open street upon which to retreat. The police wedge stopped multiple times, and every time they did so, the group ceased retreating and began antagozing officers. You either weren't there or you are lying.
Who should I believe here?
A report someone watched on TV, or someone who was there in person? I'm going to go with the latter.
I heard this also
I heard this also from people who were present -- there were people arrested who were simply unable to move as fast as the cops wanted them to move. I guarantee that some, perhaps many, perhaps most of these arrests will not stand.
Another stat
3/20 Nazis for weapons charges.
15% of the alt-right (or more!?) were dastardly low lifes looking for trouble. Surely Joe will denounce the Right for coddling them and supporting them in their terror of Boston today!
Yeah. Not sure what the final
Yeah. Not sure what the final estimate at today's crowd will come out at, but I'm guessing it's somewhere between a Bruins game and a Sox game. There are at least 27 dumbasses at any given B's game, and almost certainly at tonight's game at Fenway. Does that make the rest of us crazy?
It's simple statistics, but I guess since 45 doesn't understand them his supporters don't either.
Yeah, and how much does this
Yeah, and how much does this site publicize the 30-40 people out of 1 million arrested every St Patrick's day in Southie?
Sad that hours after a really
Plenty of people on both sides feel that way.
Well
It's a mistake to make generalizations of large groups but it's worth noting one group is advocating the elimination or relocation of minorities. 99.9% of the counter protesters are advocating peaceful coexistence of all people.
Please
Only a dope thinks that 27 people being arrested (no word on whether those arrests were justified) "make[s] the rest of us look bad". Only a chump thinks that you can appease those whose interest is not in truth but in smearing a movement by groveling to them, and so get them to say (in an unprecedented flash of honesty), "Why gosh! That really peaceful march is fine after all!" Don't fall into that trap, cybah.
Seriously, people.
No excuses please
So the obvious is the Nazis were peaceful and the peaceful marchers were not.
Report it for what it is.
Oh, OK
Surrounded by hundreds of Boston cops and 100 yards of grass, a bunch of whiny Nazis proved unable to punch anybody in Boston today. They were then taken out of the area in the safety of a police escort that included riding in vehicles without any windows.
Yes, some morons look like they were morons, but the overwhelmingly vast majority of people at the event were peaceful. I know, I was there.
You are accusing them of what
You are accusing them of what exactly? Not punching anyone? What is your qualm? Did you want them to fight the crowd? Was bad ass Adam gonna teach them a lesson?
Yep
Just like people who like to protect their 1st amendant right. Majority just go with the flow but always some who go to extremes.
Report what it is. No need to be fake news.
Had the plan always been to
Had the plan always been to escort them away in windowless police vehicles? Or did that only come into play because some people in the crowd had already been throwing stuff and BPD thought it best to avoid tempting amateur marksman with windowed vehicles?
There were a couple of MBTA buses parked alongside the Common* in the aerial view I saw. Were they the original planned shuttle for the "permit group", or were they for shuttling police & support personnel?
* or, as the NY Post calls it: Boston Common Park
And all those other marches?
This year we've had multiple marches/protests; Women's March, Pro-Immigrant March, Pro-Science March. None resulted in any violence.
Bottles are thrown and arrests occur only after an extreme Right-Wing March.
But sure, blame the progressives.
How do you figure that?
How, from 4% of the Nazis being arrested and 0.09% of the counter-protesters being arrested, do you figure that?
Another Comparison
How many people attended the Fisherman's Feast versus how many were arrested?
The St. Patrick's parade?
Playoff games at Foxborough?
.
.
.
.
3 (alleged Nazis) brought
3 (alleged Nazis) brought weapons for what reason?
Just saw that a friend had a
Just saw that a friend had a hard time getting to work (red line, from South of Boston to North) tonight. I hope that the Suburbans both crowding the T and causing Mayhem wore their Pussy Hats to indicate that they were the Virtuous Ones.
And your friend knows this was due to protesters?
As opposed to the Red Line being the Red Line?
I've seen rowdier crowds
after a Bruins game.
Actually, yes, Adam.
She sent pictures of the Suburban Placard Bearers. She assured me that she made it to work, albeit late. Only thing that happened was a dock in pay.
Thank you for your Work for the Further Furtherance of the (hypothetical) Under Privileged, Sir.
As much as I appreciate your Eye in general, I don't particularly like your Willing Blind Eye.
Why did she receive a dock in
Why did she receive a dock in pay? It was well publicized that 20K were going to be at the common and all of the close by stations would be closed. Didn't she leave early? Is she entitled to a protected escort?
and all of the close by
Actually, the MBTA's advance notices explicitly stated that with the exception of Bowdoin, ALL downtown stations would be open on Saturday.
Not this worker's fault that the T lied about the status of their system.
Try again
From the original post:
Emphasis mine.
Now, even if you're such a crankypants as to say that the T "lied" when they planned to do a thing and it proved to be impossible -- why would it even matter for someone allegedly traveling on the Red Line from "South of Boston to North"?
Your friend is on a crowded
T and that validates your anger? That would be laughable, if it werent symptomatic.
Rolls Eyes
In other words, she utterly failed to note that a huge to-do on the common would mean that (gasp) she might have to plan ahead, leave early, take a different route, etc.
This are grownup skills that we all have to learn called "paying attention" and "planning ahead".
Your friend is gonna be in real trouble
Your friend is gonna be in real trouble when she first encounters this thing called "snow".
The Good the Bad and the Ugly
The good was the restraint shown by the police who were subject to taunts, spit on and had bottles and rocks thrown at them.
The bad was that a handful of masked clowns ruined what was a well behaved and peaceful crowd of thousands.
The ugly was when masked clowns dressed in black attacked an elderly couple whose only crime was holding a large American flag.
"ruined"
You're not Miss Connie and this isn't Romper Room and you don't get to decide what constitutes "ruined". You may feel free to go pout in your corner, but don't pretend that someone like you, whose dearest wish was for this action to fail, get to determine with your sour attitude that it "failed".
While I am extremely unhappy
While I am extremely unhappy that the afterparty turned out like this (why couldn't we have all gone home after the 'protestors' fled the bandstand?)- I still think this counts as a win.
40-ish arrests (latest WCVB number) off as many as 40000 total, compared to 21 in last night's North End shenanigans, which I bet was a lot less than 40000 people.
More importantly- 0 dead, and no reports I've seen yet indicate anyone hurt badly enough to be hospitalized. After all is said and done, those are the numbers I really care about here. It could easily have been worse- there were a lot of angry people out there.
No one died?
That's the barometer by which we measure success when it comes to protests nowadays? Jesus H... This country is truly doomed.
Names and charges
BPD has released a list of the 33 people arrested and the charges they face. Mostly stuff like disturbing the peace, but a few were arrested on more serious charges, such as assault and battery with a knife.
"Drinking alcohol in public."
Right.
Clowns
The number of people commenting on this one blog alone who perceive the contrasting percentages of people arrested on either side as some sort of success rate is sad. Some of these scumbags were throwing bottles of urine at cops; I would be willing to bet that shear numbers prevented dozens more from being arrested. This began as a free speech rally, only when the media claimed it would be attended by zounds of nazis and other white supremacists did the frenzy begin. You've given them way more attention than they deserve, free speech is still a constitutional right, Trump is still president, and y'all are still butt-hurt. Cheers!
Stop with the free speech nonsense
It was called a free speech rally but the announced speakers were all white nationalist or similar types. One was famous for beating Trump protestors with a club.
https://cbsboston.files.wordpress.com/2017/08/free-speech-rally-poster.j...
Whether you
like it or not, they have the right to speak freely their vile opinions...
The First Amendment...
...exists to protect speech that is offensive, and sometimes hateful. Those who use violence to drive their pony home should be arrested and thrown is jail. But your comment makes it seem like you believe only the left has the right to free speech. However, perhaps I'm wrong, so I'll give you the chance to clarify your comments.
Grow up...
First, move south of the Mason-Dixon Line if you're going to say "y'all". Second, you're part of the reason this country is so divided. Wagging your finger and laughing while you call anti-Trump people "butt hurt" is immature and childish.
Answer these questions (I'm sure you won't...but try to humor me): how do you feel knowing that millions of white supremacists help carry Trump to the White House? How do you feel knowing that David Duke was and is one of his biggest supporters?
Adam, please stop...
It's almost like you giggle every time you type the word "Nazi". It's rather childish. Actual Nazis kicked off the bloodiest war in history. Actual Nazis murdered millions of people through industrialized genocide. No matter what they say, these angry little shit stain "white nationalist" asshats will never see see their twisted dream come to fruition.
What if Charlottesville hadn't happened? Would the left have actually allowed "alt-right" protesters to speak? No, they wouldn't. Stop sanctifying the left just because you're one of them. They're no lovers of the first amendment, and they're perfectly willing to show us. Just watch how I'll probably be ganged up on just for daring to not march in lock step with people like you. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad Boston made a show of unity against hate. But don't put the counter protesters on a pedestal. Given the right circumstances, things could have gone much differently.
Ok let the snark and mouth foaming commence :)
The comments are always the
The comments are always the most interesting parts of these posts. Adam, I love that you've made this site, a legitimate, viable source of local news.
I also understand your politics. Surprisingly, you seemed to have published comments that don't agree with your own view. That's appreciated, since 9 out of 10 times, you don't post my comments, even though they are relevant and (my bias) insightful.
I am glad that others read this site who are not necessarily pink-hatted, lily-white antifa's. I hope we get to the point where the left quits trying to bring the sitting president down, and focuses their energy on working together to solve the country's problems. Am so sick of this nonsense. It is unproductive, and destructive.
So get over yourselves, Lefties! Let's be glad that no one was seriously hurt during this yesterday, and move forward. I didn't love BHO either, but accepted him as the president for 8 years. Why can't you all do the same?
MAGA!!!!!!!!!!!!
Interesting...
You say you accepted Obama for 8 years, yet you can't even say his name. In fact, you still insist on emphasizing his middle name. What, his birth cirtificate wasn't good enough for you?
Part of healing the country is getting the moron you worship out of office. He's toxic. And if you support him, so are you.
"Get over yourselves Lefties"
"Get over yourselves Lefties"?!
Your President made excuses for the neo-Nazis in Charlottesville. Not only we lefties, but both Presidents Bush, John McCain, MITCH McCONNELL (!), Paul Ryan and every other prominent Republican felt it necessary to renounce his statements.
A little background for you. You're welcome.
No one has stopped the Right fro speaking on the Common
Not the Tea Party back in, I think, 2010.
Not the gun rights freaks a few months ago.
Not the Libertarian twerps who marched around with a gadsden flag on July 3.
I'm sure there are others, as well, but you can look that up.
And the "left" couldn't get anywhere near the bandstand-- Medlar's group of jokers could have stayed out there a few more hours & still been escorted out, if they had wished. They didn't.
If Charlottesville hadn't happened ...
this weekend would have been like the last time these losers came to Boston Common in May. Most of us ignored them then and found better things to do with a Saturday afternoon. We changed our mind after Charlottesville and decided that a show of overwhelmingly superior numbers was needed this time.
Here's a tip
If you don't like him bringing up Nazis, then tell your friends to stop wearing emblems associated with Nazism, Fascism, and White Supremacy when they march around.
Shit, even Godwin himself tweeted out "these are Nazis! Call them Nazis!"
When these twits stop self-identifying as Nazis, perhaps people will stop calling them Nazis?
I am flummoxed by your
I am flummoxed by your "actual Nazi" line. A Nazi is a Nazi, whether or not they happened to live in a time that allowed them to murder people over it. History repeats itself- assuming that modern Nazis will "never see their twisted dream come to fruition" is idiotic. The only way that we can make sure it never happens again is by speaking up LOUDLY and OFTEN whenever necessary. I'm sure I don't have to quote Martin Niemöller's First They Came poem to you, but it has been very relevant lately.
I also have to say, painting the other side with a broad brush has got to stop. So many people on both sides are saying "the left loves this", "the right is full of this". You cannot define an entire group with such broad generalizations. I would love to see your facts around how the "left" are "no lovers of the first amendment". What kind of idiotic rhetoric is that? I'm sure some fringe people on both sides have said stupid things, but I have never met anyone that opposes the first amendment, and I'm willing to bed most people can say the same thing.
Boston Police release names of the 33 arrested
http://bpdnews.com/news/2017/8/19/nwez3w61jv5rm1ub2siyofkbizrvki
Well, except a 15 year old girl from Cambridge (Delinquent to wit Assault & Battery by Means of Dangerous Weapon (2 counts), Delinquent to wit Disorderly Conduct).
Wow, the KKK is recruiting them young.
Huh?!
You think KKK recruits were arrested?! As if there were any there?! Wow!
Which side were the trouble
Which side were the trouble makers on? Does anyone know?
An organizer of the march describes the people who were arrested
and calls for the charges to be dropped against them:
DiDi Delgado's post