People in West Roxbury - and Roslindale - who get those blue ValPak envelopes filled with coupons this week got at least one "coupon" that advertises an alleged conspiracy by the "bicycle lobby" and people from outside the neighborhood to destroy West Roxbury by forcing bike lanes onto Centre Street, and down the throats of the good citizens of that leafy neighborhood.
The "coupons" do not indicate who paid for them and do not mention that the city ignored calls to do something about pedestrian problems along the windy four-lane road until a West Roxbury resident walking in a Centre Street crosswalk died after being hit by a motorist who said she was blinded by the sun - at the same intersection where another West Roxbury resident suffered a traumatic brain injury three years earlier when he was hit by a motorist who sped by another driver who had stopped to let him walk across the street.
After an emotional meeting at the West Roxbury Elks Club following Marilyn Wentworth's death, city planners began looking at a proposal to essentially narrow Centre Street to three lanes - one travel lane in each direction and a turning lane in the middle, with pedestrian islands at several intersections.
The proposal would allow for dedicated bike lanes - the street does not currently have any. At a raucous meeting at Holy Name School, some people who do not live in West Roxbury, including the owner of a Jamaica Plain bicycle shop, supported the plan. However, the bulk of bicyclists - or parents of bicyclists - who rose to support the idea gave West Roxbury addresses, and discussed how they tried to avoid Centre Street because it is so dangerous.
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Comments
After hours
By Mark-
Thu, 10/17/2019 - 7:54am
The 7-Eleven is open 24 hours a day. Which is more than I can say for 99% of the rest of Boston.
Oh you said the special economy word
By spin_o_rama
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 5:03pm
Funny thing about that and bike lanes:
https://www.citylab.com/solutions/2015/03/the-comp...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2018/11/1...
https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2012/12/cyc...
https://usa.streetsblog.org/2012/03/23/why-bicycli...
I almost would not care
By redbaron
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:21pm
If they cut down the lanes and put in the turn lanes. The thing that bothers me is the Bike Lanes. what does that have to do with safety??? I mean it's just somehtiing else you have to look out for. This is going nowhere,
It's safety for people that
By anon
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:50pm
It's safety for people that are trying to get off the road to help reduce congestion for people that feel they can't live without their car. Car owners aren't the end all be all. It's just that we are so used to getting everything we want...for some it's hard to accept that times are a changing.
We should thank the people that want to bike, walk, skate, or take the T to work.
So would it be alright if
By redbaron
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 4:45pm
I use my Horse and Buggy to commute, or just my horse the buggy might congest the road.
Skate?? Rollerblades and Skateboards, what about scooters and electric scooters
Keep sticking your head in the sand Red
By spin_o_rama
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 3:06pm
Countless links have been shared with you about the safety benefits of bike lanes that are not exclusive to those riding bikes.
Also if looking out for bikes is such a burden on you, please consider turning in your license because you shouldn't be driving.
Math lesson
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 3:44pm
Which is bigger:
10,000 or 5?
300 or 1/2?
Motor vehicle crashes kill around 30,000 people per year in the US and 1/3 are pedestrians. Cycle crashes with pedestrians? About 5 per year.
Somewhere around 300 pedestrians per year in MA are killed by motorists. I'm being generous with the 1/2 for the local toll for cyclists - it has been a while in Boston, and it runs about 2-3 a year in NYC.
And how many
By GrampaNurgle
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 8:52pm
Of those deaths are caused by murderous drivers(c)Kinopio&Co and not by people’s own stupidity? You know, things like dashing out into traffic without looking, running red lights, blowing past large trucks on the right at a busy intersection, etc.
And I readily admit there are idiot drivers out there, but maybe, just maybe, it makes sense to really crack down on that small subset instead of making every driver’s life miserable? Because you see, a speeding drunkard will run you down on a six lane busy street or a one and a half car lane and ten bike lane utopian superhighway, makes no difference to him.
#victimblaming #whataboutism
By DTP
Thu, 10/17/2019 - 8:43am
#victimblaming
#whataboutism
Roads are for people, not
By MattyC
Thu, 10/17/2019 - 10:21am
Roads are for people, not cars. If people want to gallop down Centre St. on a horse, its legal, so be my guest. Just stop at the lights.
They say the road diet plan
By anon
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 7:12am
is all about safety especially because the woman was hit and killed. The reason the woman was hit was because of solar glare. Making the road one lane each way would not have helped in that situation. I saw a woman and her daughter almost get hit by a car in Brookline crossing a two lane road. The traffic on the other side was bumper to bumper and stopped. They walked into a crosswalk between two of those cars and a driver in front of me had to slam on his brakes because he didn't see them until they came into our lane from between the cars. I'll admit that I often don't see pedestrians crossing Centre until I'm already going through the crosswalk. The only real way to protect pedestrians is with flashing crossing lights which I hope they put in whether the road diet goes through or not.
Almost there, you're getting close
By fungwah
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:00am
So, visibility is bad and traffic goes too fast through there to be able to stop in time for pedestrians? Hmm, sounds like maybe something could be done to, I don't know, slow down cars and ensure that they're traveling a safe speed even if there's glare or other visibility issues. Now, what are some effective measures that are known to cause drivers to slow down, even more than just installing more signs...
And the award for most snarky goes to...
By Roztonian
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:06am
Good Lord, if you are trying to get people on your side, try to dial back the enlightened, elitist, anti-car snarkiness.
Road diet. Haha.
Sorry for not coddling dangerous drivers I guess?
By fungwah
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 11:44am
The OP literally mentioned that they regularly blow through crosswalks on Centre with people in them because "they didn't see them" but yeah sure a snarky tone is the real problem here, some great priorities for sure
Ok, fung..
By whyaduck
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:15am
I will assume that you live in West Roxbury and/or frequent the area quite often. No?
So with that assumption in mind, let us look at your assumptions.
1. Visibility is bad and traffic goes too fast, to stop in time for pedestrians.
If you frequent the area, you know that the traffic moves so slowly there, at times, because of the congestion. In fact, unless you are traveling through in the early morning hours, the street is usually slow going.
Aside from this unfortunate accident, which looks like it was due to solar glare, most traffic stops for pedestrians or we would have more dead bodies.
Thus,
2. Slowing down traffic
This is the newest bike zealot talking point. Hey, lets slow down the cars. Ok, we are at, what 25mph in the city now? And yet this woman was hit. Slowing down traffic is not going to do anything to stop congestion, which makes more frustrated drivers, which does not make commuting better for anyone, bike or car.
3. Solutions?
We have a road network that no longer can support the amount of traffic (and this is due to a myriad of reasons). We have a generally crappy and not convenient public transportation system. Making traffic move slower is not going to solve these problems.
If you frequent the area, you
By anon
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:34am
No, traffic moves super fast, it's just a cycle of SPEED-STOP-SPEED-STOP, combined with people double parking, clogging up traffic making left hand turns, etc, which then encourages people to switch lanes back and forth during their SPEED phase.
removing lights but forcing people to not drive as fast will be a wash for car drivers but will allow them to drive in a way that's safer for everyone else.
This entire comment is making
By Miss M
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 10:38am
This entire comment is making me wonder if you ever actually drive on Centre St.
1) No one follows the 25 mph speed limit. I try to and what usually happens is I get tailgated, then sped around in either the right or left lane.
2) More than once I've stopped to let someone cross the street and had the person in the other lane blow right through the crosswalk. More than once I've been crossing a crosswalk on Centre. St and had a car speed past me after a car in one lane had stopped for me. Saying "most traffic stops for pedestrians" is like saying "most cars don't get into accidents, so kids don't need car seats." You're saying a dead body every three years or so doesn't matter.
And your solution is...do nothing? Great, super helpful.
How pedestrians get hit on Centre Street
By adamg
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 11:11am
More than once I've stopped to let someone cross the street and had the person in the other lane blow right through the crosswalk.
This.
Yes, the poor woman in February was hit by a woman allegedly blinded by solar glare, but I don't know what they're teaching in driver's ed these days, but I learned that if you can't see because the sun's in your eyes, you slow the hell down.
In any case, the man who had his head smashed into the pavement three years earlier at the same exact intersection, who has also spoken at community meetings, so it's not like it's some big secret, was hit because of a driver who didn't bother to wonder why another driver had stopped at that intersection.
Public Service Announcement
By tachometer
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 3:32pm
I want to be clear that I am not victim blaming but am sharing a piece of safety advice that might help prevent others from getting into an accident or hurt.
When the sun is low, whether you are driving a car, on a motorcycle, bicycle or walking, keep in your mind that "Your shadow points to the people who can't see you."
When you are looking towards the person who can't see you your vision is crystal clear because the sun is behind you so it's easy to assume that they can see you just as well which can be a devastating mistake.
What about Count Dracula
By redbaron
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 4:21pm
Vampires have no shadows or reflections in a mirror.
Also a Flame has not shadow.
A person who cast no shadow has no soul
Only cross the street a night
Tip stay off you cell phone and stop drinking a Beverages when crossing the street and look
both ways like you mother told you. That's all out the window if it is a Bike bearing down on you because they don't stop anyway.
This is hysterical
By Bill B
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 10:50am
Thanks for the laugh. (1) except for morning / evening rush when there’s congestion, drivers race from light to light. There’s no congestion or slow moving traffic most of the day. I walk Centre Street most days. (2) very few people keep it to 25. I do and have tailgaters and honkers behind me all the time. You pretty much have to be ready to get into it with people if you drive 25. And “most traffic stops for pedestrians†is gold. Have you ever crossed on foot? I do every day and typically 2-5 cars pass before someone stops. Then you deal with drivers going around the car that stopped.
To get cars to stop you need to assert yourself and show them your walking in front of them. Which as a large person that’s able to move quickly I can do. But I always see older folks or kids standing two steps into the crosswalk watching a stream of cars go by. Even when drovers notice people they often don’t want to slow down.
A slower design will actually slow speed and get people on foot the attention to cross safely.
Walk down to the Traffic Light
By redbaron
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 4:24pm
Press the button and wait for the signal to cross. There is certainly enough Traffic lihgts on Centre street. 9 or 10 forget the Pedestrian crossing,
So now pedestrians and or
By anon
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 5:07pm
So now pedestrians and or bikers are not allowed to use the crosswalks with no signals? Can you admit that you like to be contrary just to be contrary?
Okay, Whyaduck
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 11:21am
Present evidence that rebuts or at least nuances the data supplied in the references that Spin presented, as well as by the people redesigning the traffic control scheme in the area.
In other words, your vitriolic talking points gibberish isn't a convincing counter argument - its all just emotional tautology. Argue the actual issues with data, facts, and research, please.
How many people have died or injured on Centre street
By redbaron
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:26pm
Is it much more than any other area of the city. I think not. Just outside Bike groups
Go ride in the Arbs, Jamaica Pond or even better Local Cemeteries. Plenty of room. No need to commute to work on a bike, you get into work all sweaty, body odor?? What's the point.
Run to work and take a shower. Better exercise.
how many ?
By Bobp
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:44pm
Too many...
BTW i have counted since May, i personally have seen a car not stop for a pedestrian in the crosswalk 7 times. Almost always the pedestrian needs to stop or go back. This is not including the right turn on red jerk turning from corey to Centre who weaved through pedestrians a few weeks ago
Wow 7 Times in 5 months
By redbaron
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 4:27pm
That might be me. I wonder how many Bikes have gone right through the lights probaly 700 times.
Happens to me every time I
By anon
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 5:11pm
Happens to me every time I walk Centre to do my errands, walk my dog, go get a coffee, go to eat. So that many times a week. I am just one person and I am not the only one it happens to...do the math.
I feel badly for you...you seem so angry about everything.
Not a bad idea but
By fungwah
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:50pm
Great places to ride - now, how do you propose someone who lives in West Roxbury gets to Jamaica Pond or the Arboretum via bicycle if they're not supposed to ride anywhere else?
are you kidding?!?
By cat
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:59pm
by car of course. just like the folks that drive to Millennium Park to walk - because our sidewalks and streets are not safe for pedestrians.
Why don't you limit your driving to interstates?
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 3:40pm
Those are the only roads that were actually made for cars.
The rest of the roads were definitely not made for cars, so you shouldn't drive there.
/your logic
Shorter redbaron
By Miss M
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 6:29pm
"I, personally, have not been hit and killed by a car on Centre St., therefore there is no problem with its traffic pattern."
Seriously?
By Manny
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:34pm
I walk and cross Center St at least 4-5 times a week. This is the quote that I like from your response
"Aside from this unfortunate accident, which looks like it was due to solar glare, most traffic stops for pedestrians or we would have more dead bodies."
Last night I almost got hit crossing Center St from the 7-11 to the Porter Cafe. If you frequent the area you know that the Police station is the building next to the 7-11. Crossing last night already in the cross walk and here comes Mr Ford Explorer bombing around the Rotary and exiting on to Center Street and looked right at me and sped along off towards Rochies all the while having the Police Station on his left. No regard for any one or anything.
If most traffic stops for you then you sir are the luckiest man in WR. We don't have more deaths because pedestrians are aware of the fact that most people DO NOT STOP when there are people crossing.
On top of that the rotary at Holy Name is a death trap. I cannot count how many times I have almost been hit because cars coming off the rotary are speeding and can't (won't) stop
wow stop driving please
By spin_o_rama
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:08am
I learned something interesting last week
By Waquiot
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:18am
As part of this plan, they are going to remove signals at a few intersections. Those signals help people cross the street more safely. Removing the signals would do nothing to prevent the death that happened earlier in the year.
I think the bike lanes are a good idea, but this plan does not help pedestrians. It is a plan driven by ideology and opposed by the opposite number.
Really?
By cinnamngrl
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:58am
http://www.northeastern.edu/peter.furth/road-diet-...
Saving lives is an idealogy? This research and plan has been linked and discussed repeatedly on Uhub, but you just found a missing signal? Do you pay attention to anything you read? This is how you repeatedly offend so many people. Random perverse hot takes to gather attention.
There are two ideologies at work here
By Waquiot
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 2:46pm
If you concede that the group that made this flyer has an ideological bent, the other side must have one too.
By the way, reread my comment and ask yourself what my opinion on this proposal is. It's not too hard to figure out what I wrote. But to summarize, there may be some problems with the plan. The plan is supposed to help pedestrians, but some elements might not help pedestrians in the end. Those problems are probably correctable. Others have offered a defense of the plan, but you decided to take a potshot, because that is who you are and what you do. That is why you repeatedly offend so many people.
Projection
By cinnamngrl
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 7:37pm
your comment was a random hot take potshot that demonstrates poor understanding of the issue.
Are you comparing the people that made the flyer with Dr. Furth? Are you claiming there opinions about the configuration of Centre have equal foundation in research and design? Because that is dishonest.
So what idealogy are you talking about? Do you have any idea why the road diet is proposed? hint: I linked it again.
Trying reading your own comments and responses. just repeating what I wrote is silly.
tl/dr
By SwirlyGrrl
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 7:54pm
I
w
i
l
l
s
a
v
e
y
o
u
b
o
t
h
s
o
m
e
t
i
m
e
.
thank you
By cinnamngrl
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 8:08pm
thank you
Brilliant
By Waquiot
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:08pm
(She’s a bit obsessed with me.)
off topic, but then you don't
By cinnamngrl*
Thu, 10/17/2019 - 9:08am
off topic, but then you don't understand the topic so...
Narrator: No, she isn't.
By MattyC
Thu, 10/17/2019 - 10:22am
Narrator: No, she isn't.
Except...
By DOT Worker
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 9:59am
You def heard the news last week, but you didn't seem to learn anything except the news.
Removing additional intersections, especially aging signals, is likely more of an attempt to allow an easier flow of traffic instead of uncoordinated signals that create more traffic; and consequentially, safety concerns as drivers may decide to run more red lights to avoid waiting at the signal for another cycle. It has been shown that decreasing the crossing distance (with sidewalk bump outs) and implementing RRFBs is an effective method to allow pedestrians to safely cross the roadway, as well as increasing driver compliance.
a+++++++ this is a useful and
By locke
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 11:32am
a+++++++ this is a useful and informative post
Bruh
By eeka
Thu, 10/17/2019 - 9:41am
this isn't eBay
It will be safe to cross
By Bill B
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 10:38am
The signals were added because it’s never safe to cross four lanes. With one lane each way people can cross safely with a crosswalk and not a light. The traffic study (if you believe in research done by experts) showed those intersections don’t have enough traffic turning onto Centre to require a stoplight. Once the road is three lanes people only need to get one driver’s attention at a time to cross. And drivers will have less road to watch and more attention for walkers. The major benefit here is two less stops when you’re driving. Saves time.
Excuse me?
By Bob Leponge
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 1:49pm
No, that's not at all the reason the woman was hit. The woman was hit because a driver, knowing full well that solar glare was interfering with the driver's ability to see, decided not to do what any responsible person would do and bring the vehicle to a stop, but instead decided to continue piloting 4,000 lbs of steel blindly into a crowded stretch of road.
I don't normally wade into these bike v car love fests, but your attempt to excuse recklessly irresponsible driving that led to a human fatality by blaming it on the sun offends me.
Centre St is very treacherous for crossing
By hollydollydoo
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 11:42pm
A family friend got hit crossing at the library. During the day. She was hit so hard that she landed on the windshield of the car.
Shows how despirate ValPak is
By Gary C
Wed, 10/16/2019 - 8:16am
Doonesbury has been running old repeat comics where Mike is unable to find a decent job so he stoops to designing handbills for strip clubs. Similar thing here.
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